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Jabba,

I think it all boils down to the question wether the "free markets" ideology is some kind of natural law, or just another human conception, some kind of new faith and religion.
If the Toshiba tv is the cheapest one, and you chose it, because your labour has no good price on the market, and you hardly get along, you will just say: bad luck. To raise your voice and tell people, how shitty your tv was, you would need to become visible in some far-reaching media, unfortunately they rely on Toshiba ads, and think your just some paid Toshiba trasher maybe.
You did not answer my questions:

"So, the free market will protect human rights, will protect people not needed by the markets, will protect the environment, will build infrastructure in places where it only serves poor people without any profit, because they cannot afford to pay much..."

?

Niko,

How will you avoid corruption? Isnt it part of the free market as well? Corruption not only happens in governments. How will you avoid child prostitution, child labour, slavery? What about heroin dealers? If the market happens to some gain advantages by selling bad medication or food, who will be the one to stop that, if this food and medication is the only one affordable for less wealthy people?

Do you really deny, that by turning everything into a commodity, many important and beautiful aspects of human life will be lost? Currently, we afford to pay for operas and theaters which show unpopular strange stuff. We finance movies that totally loose in the box office, we finance scientists who explore things not "necessary". Will there only be culture to fit the lowest common denominator? Profitable culture? We already head that way.

In the world you imagine education, like everything, serves a purpose: It is supposed to produce workers who know how to do their jobs. It is not supposed to make people evolve as personalities anymore, unless the market demands some elites with personalities, and with regard to another discussion I had here: They will not need to know about greek philosophy, egyptian art or the history of the 16th century anymore, at least not for the "common people". That would be a waste. And wasting stuff or oneself, or gifts that serve no special purpose, poetry, and similar irrational acts are a no-go in a rational free market. Unless they happen for advertising or recreational purposes, then they are rational. Time is money, right?

Niko, So your point is, that currently we do not have any free market utopia yet anywhere?

How can you be sure then, that it will be so great, is it some kind of theory you read in a book?
As for the rest of your answer, maybe my english is too bad, I do not understand what you are talking about.

Maybe someone will be able to answer my questions from above?

@Gerd

"That would really be the worst option. I have some hopes in the EU and in international treaties. The future will show. The Hayek, Mises ideology was quite fashionable in the last fifteen years or so among elites and leaders world-wide, but fashions come and got, while the real problems, that emerge, will make compromises and really new strategies necessary. "

Last 50 Years?
Wrong, you've never read von Hayek or Mises have your? Or Chicago economists like Friedman?

Reagan '80 and Thatcher '79 were not 50 years ago. The IDEAS may have been around since WWII, but never implemented.

The world trade organisation is still in it's infancy. I hope it continues, but at a gradual pace. Change is most easily accepted, culturally, when it's done slowly...


"In the eastern european countries, people are not happy as well and are beginning to form unions, deman minimum wages and so on. Also in Asia, people will demand more liberty as well as more social security in the future. "

Like tianammen square?

Apart from China's communist party slogans of "to get rich is good" and "it doesn't matter if the cat is black or white, so long as it catches mice" are all well and nice. But china has not shown any even suggest a democracy. They may make reforms, invite foreign capital, but they will NEVER relenquish power!

"And through democracy, people will decide world-wide, how they want to live. It might differ to what you imagine them to want in the long term. We will see."

Apart from "some" countries whose religion, traditions, beliefs are in obvious conflict with liberal democracy: saudia arabia or islamic sharias. These countries will need to follow the gradual pace of change I mentioned in economics without the bloody accelarator of revolution...

Gerd,

Germany lacks the will today to reform. So if I am to read correctly what you meant is that you have no faith in the Germany government? Your faith is now in the faceless unaccountable nameless administrators at the EU.

If Germany will not reform, not live within the stablization clause it demanded to form the euro why should any other nation in the EU take this seriously. Why should they punish their citizens by not giving them the same "goodies" the Germans now enjoy.

** I am quite sure if Germany was within the limits of the stablility clause for the euro and another nation was not, Germany would want to toss them out of the euro or at least punish them**

Your government, the Germany government along with the french, are trying to force the same restrictive laws, regulations and taxes on the other nations of Europe. These are what are the causes for the state of decline of the Germans and french. I think those governments will resist both the Germans and the french or they should.

I had to laugh at the Germans when they were concerned about people from the east coming to Germany after the EU expanded. It was what unfortuantely has become so typical of Germany today. It failed to realize that jobs would be flowing east. If one can find employment in their own nation and support their familes why in the world would they want to move to Germany and france? They would not.

So Germany is faced with a future which is not at all bright. You have an aging population, negative birthrate, and ever increasing consumption of the nation's wealth by the government.

Of course, you can raise taxes on businesses and individuals to fund social justice and the failing welfare state and all this will do is to drive the production to other nations. It is already happening. This is just the beginning there is going to be even more bad news.

So hopefully the Germans will elect Gerhart to another term, put more Greens in power, and continue with all the policies which are currently in place. This will insure the future you seem to want and hope for.

While you are focused on what the US is doing or not doing to suit you, the US will continue to change and so will China and the rest of the world. The only place in the world it seems that is static is Germany.

Enjoy your socalist heaven that you have created.

Gerd,

One other point.. I am not sure just what you meant about having hope in the EU and international treaties.

I cannot see how any of those can work if the individual nations do not do their part.

How much of Lisbon 2000 has Germany implemented? We both know the answer ... not very much.

How much economy growth and development has taken place in Germany? We both know that answer too... not very much.

You can take all the smart people in all of Germany and put them in a room and come up with the perfect answer and if no one will take action then it is all a waste of time.

That is what is going on now. You are delaying the difficult choices and the hard decision for the future but with each passing year the future becomes closer. It also means the decisions become more difficult and more painful.

It is not going to be a choice at some point. No action is also a choice. So if you do not choose solution A and you do not choose solution B or whatever the solution. You have in fact made a choice. It is the worse choice possible.

This is much like what GWB said ... you are either with us or you are against us. There is no middle ground in this. As much as people will search, there is none.

It is the same with the reforms in Germany. You will reform or you will not reform. But by choosing to neither or not implemmeting all the needed reforms you are not reforming.

So you give to someone else the responsiblity of selecting for you. They will. The world will. As they move forward and you are static, then you are in decline.

With maybe the excption of the french who will be in the same shape you are in, no one else will really care.

Those are you options. You might not like them. They are at the end of the day the only two you have..

Enjoy.... BUT most of all think what is being written. You have a choice to reject all of this or to at least look at it and see another side.

@joe
So as a good German, you should and I think you do, not worry about America. America is going to be just fine. I encourage you to worry about your own nation. Worry about your declining standard of living and the rot and decay which now seems to infect you. I surely do not worry about it. I am indifferent to you and your future.

my living standard is absolutely great! rot and decay has probably infected you (as one of biggest germany hater on this board) and not me!
I am glad we are indifferent!
And dont be surprised I LOVE MY COUNTRY!

have a nice day too

Fakt ist, dass der Islam in seiner Grundkonzeption die modernste der drei grossen Religionen ist, die ihre Ursprünge in Abhraham haben. Muslime kennen keine Kirchen, Konvertierung ist unkompliziert, es gibt keine Sakramente, kein Mittler steht zwischen Gläubigem und Gott. Eigentlich eine tolle Erfindung. Was wir aber in den letzten Jahrhunderten erlebt haben ist ein Hijacking der Religion durch Hardliner, die sukzessive den Islam umdeuten und Restriktionen und Vorschriften erfinden, wo es nie welche gab. Eine grossartige Religion, die zunehmend pervertiert wird. Leidtragende sind zunehmend moderate Muslime. Schlimmer noch ist aber, dass der Westen fast ausschliesslich auf die Hardliner hört, und mit diesen kommuniziert. Kaum einer im Westen weiss, dass das Konzept des Immams mitnichten im Islam angelegt ist. Der Westen fällt drauf rein, und schaut tatenlos zu, wie immer mehr Muslime - auch mitten in Deutschland - umerzogen werden.

Grossartig. Das klingt schon wesentlich vernuenftiger. Du hebst dich deutlich von denen ab, die hier eine islamische Weltverschwoerung konstruieren wolle, eine Theorie aehnlich abstrus wie die Protokolle von Zion.

Wenn du moechtest, koennen wir gerne noch per E-Mail weiterdiskutieren.


@racker

"And dont be surprised I LOVE MY COUNTRY!"

Excellent, glad you like it. I hold Germany fondly too. An important cornerstone of that must be your Constitution.

America -> German Constitution

racker,

I do not hate Germany at all. To be indifferent is not the same as hating. Hating requires too much effort. The Germany of today is not worth that effort on my part. I have much more important things to do than waste time on that.

I have great pity for you and the people who live there. I am glad your standard of living is what it is. It is to be admired by all. My question to you is for how much longer will you retain it.

The parts of my postings you and those like you seem to want to ignore is about the future.

It is like Nilkas. He never did address if there was a need for change in Germany. Do you think there is a need for change? If so why? And what change?

I think it is interesting you would call my comments hateful yet the are mild compared to those of many Germans and of course the dribble which flows from your elites be they in a press room or in your universities or in Berlin.

The rot and decay is reference to you society and your institutions. They are failing you. You might not choose to believe that but they are by any international measure. I realize that is a bitter pill and something no one wants to recongize but if people like you do not, then who is?

If you fail to realize what is going on around you, then there is no way you can change the outcome.

From your comment, your life is good. That is great. What of the lives of your one day children or those of your parents? What is the future going to be like for them.

I did note with interest you did not say anything about Lisbon or about growth or investment.

You can toss out whatever comments that makes you feel pride in your nation. The fact you feel pride in Germany I think is a very good thing. I wished more Germans did. If they did there might be hope for your nation. As it now stands not enough do, it is as if everyone is just looking out for themselves and being very selfish about it. You might disagree and that is fine too.

My suggestion to you is to look critically at what is taking place and see where you can influnece postive change.



@joe

Good point

@racker

Indifferent, in dem Begriff, auf deutsch heisst gleichgültig...

racker, Niklas, et al,

As you know I tend to write about change and focus and responisiblity a lot. I also write about the future.

Here is an example of the world making choices for Germany. It is the possible loss of almost 800,000 in the next few years. These jobs are going to be moved from Germany to some place else.

Now even if you are not one of the 800,000 who might lose their job, it is going to impact on the rest of the nation because of the decrease in tax collection and the increase in social welfare spending.

The US is creating jobs and investments are being made here both by American corporations and corporations from other nations. Dell is buidling a new computer assembly plant in North Carolina. Honda is building a new transmission plant in Georgia.

Compare this to the news from Germany.

You might call this a bright future but by my standards it is not.

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/briefs/0,1574,1391547,00.html

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