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The Debate
- "In much of Europe's public debate, the true meaning of human rights has degenerated into a tool that gives anti-Americanism an aura of legitimacy. The real, horrendous human-rights violations in the Middle East, North Korea, China, Cuba, etc., are largely ignored or relegated to news blurs on the back pages. For front-page coverage, you need an American angle." ---The Wall Street Journal
- "I discovered that European social democracy, too, was a kind of fundamentalism, rigid and doctrinaire, yielding what Swedish writer Johan Norberg calls "one-idea states"—nations where an echo chamber of insular elites calls the shots, where monochrome media daily reiterate statist mantras and shut out contrarian views, and where teachers and professors systematically misrepresent the U.S. (millions of Europeans believe that free public schools, unemployment insurance, and pensions are unknown in America). The more I saw of the European elites' chronic distrust of the public, and the public's habitual deference to those elites, the fonder I grew of the nasty, ridiculous rough-and-tumble of American democracy..." ---Bruce Bawer
- "In the European media as well as on the public stage, prizes and publicity go overwhelmingly to Americans who serve as witnesses against their own government and nation. (...) The defense mechanism is simple enough: "After all, they are saying this, too, so how can we be accused of anti-Americanism?" A similar phenomenon attaches itself to Israel, where "post-" or anti-Zionist spokesmen are given top billing in the European media." ---Josef Joffe
- "The point is to be aware that for many of the foreigners issuing what they claim to be "simply constructive criticism", the evidence shows that criticizing America is all they do, criticizing America is all they ever have done, and criticizing America is all they ever will do." ---Erik Svane, Americans Anonymous
- "To get an impression, take a look at David's Medienkritik, a Web log in English dedicated, among other things, to exposing biased reporting on the United States in the German media. Be it stories about the war in Iraq, the conduct of U.S. soldiers abroad, American reservations regarding the Kyoto Protocol and the International Criminal Court or even the Katrina disaster, more often than not the German public is presented with a distorted picture. There are laudable exceptions. But generally the blows are low, and the public is left to form its opinion base on half-truths and false analyses." ---Julian Knapp
- "Negative sentiments and views have been driven not only - or even primarily - by what the United States does, but rather by an animus against what Europeans have believed that America is. While the politics, style, and discourse of the Bush terms - and of President Bush as a person - have undoubtedly exacerbated anti-American sentiment among Europeans and fostered a heretofore unmatched degree of unity between elite and mass opinion in Europe, they are not anti-Americanism's cause. Indeed, a change to a center-left administration in Washington, led by a Democratic president, would not bring about its abatement, let alone its disappearance." ---Andrei Markovits
- "Anti-Americanism is hypocrisy at its finest. You can spend your evening catching the latest episode of "24" and then complain about Guantanamo the next morning. You can claim that the Americans have themselves to blame for terrorism, while at the same time calling for tougher restrictions on Muslim immigration to Germany. You can call the American president a mass murderer and book a flight to New York the next day. You can lament the average American's supposed lack of culture and savvy and meanwhile send off for the documents for the Green Card lottery. Not a day passes in Germany when someone isn't making the wildest claims, hurling the vilest insults or spreading the most outlandish conspiracy theories about the United States. But there's no risk involved and it all serves mainly to boost the German feeling of self-righteousness." ---C.C. Malzahn
- "The protests against nuclear weapons, for instance, concentrated on American weapons. The anti-war rallies were against American-led wars. The anti death penalty campaign focused on Texas. A pattern was emerging and has never seriously been altered. A pattern of willingness to condemn America for the tiniest indiscretion - or to magnify those indiscretions - while leaving the murderers, dictators, and thieves who run other nations oddly untouched." ---Justin Webb
- The fundamental role of anti-Americanism in Europe in general, and particularly among those on the Left, is to absolve themselves of their own moral failings and intellectual errors by heaping them onto the monster scapegoat, the United States of America. For stupidity and bloodshed to vanish from Europe, the U.S. must be identified as the singular threat to democracy (contrary to every lesson of actual history)." ---Jean-François Revel
- "In five years there will be a different President and Iraq will likely be pacified. That would naturally have impacts on the strength of the resentments that have fixed themselves onto certain individuals in the present situation. But beneath the surface smolder the long-burning embers of latent anti-Americanism. It has a long tradition and will remain, also when President Bush is no longer in office and Palestine is peaceful." ---Lutz Erbring
- "A writer for the German weekly Der Spiegel told me during the Iraq debate not to take offense at the crude anti-American covers of the magazine such as the ugly, bearded, drooling Rambo figure it used to show the typical GI in Iraq. 'We're just trying to please our million readers,' he explained." ---Jeff Gedmin
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April 2023
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Flugblatt aus Irak:
"Wir, eure Brüder aus der Provinz Al-Anbar und der Stadt Faluja, richten diesen Aufruf an Sie und erklären, dass wir Sie unter der Fahne "Gott ist Groß" und zur Förderung des Islam und der Muslime gegen die Heiden, Besatzer, Eroberer und habgierige unreine Juden unterstützen, die den reinen Boden und die heiligen Städte verunreinigt haben.
Wir stehen hinter Herrn Muqtada El-Sadr und verfolgen ihn mit Aufmerksamkeit aufgrund seiner Haltung betreffend die Befreiung des Irak von den aggressiven Heiden, die unsere Alten, Wissenschaftler und religiösen Gelehrten angegriffen haben,
Wir alle erklären unsere Bereitschaft zur Befreiung der Heimat, Förderung und Erweiterung der Religion Gottes auf der ganzen Welt. Wir unterstützen Sie in ihrem Jihad, im Krieg gegen die Ungläubigen als religiöse Pflicht, und führen, welche Mittel Sie auch immer für diesen Krieg geeignet finden, aus."
Gezeichnet ist das Flugblatt mit "Eure Brüder aus der Provinz Al-Anbar und Faluja".
Mehr hier:
http://www.juedische.at/TCgi/TCgi.cgi?target=home&Param_Kat=3&Param_RB=10&Param_Red=2264
Posted by: Gabi | May 12, 2004 at 07:57 AM
You've exhausted what little German I have.
Danke
Posted by: Mike H. | May 12, 2004 at 08:55 AM
Nice Cartoon, allthough completely absent of reality.
All I see today is news reports about the beheading of Nick Berg. Worldwide.
And that doesnt surprise me, cause that is how the media works. Worldwide.
Posted by: Stephan | May 12, 2004 at 11:58 AM
Yes, NEWS reports. They report the fact what happened. That's all. Any reaction in Germany about this act? Any support for the USA? Don't we stand at their side?
Kerry said this:
''There is no excuse under any circumstance for an act of terror such as happened today. None. You can't blame it on anything except terrorists.''
-- Sen. John Kerry, D-Mass.
I wish the German politicians would say the same. There is a need to condemn the terror. To report the fact is not enough. That is what the terrorists want: A platform. The media give them this platform. They want to frighten the people, especially the Americans. Shouldn't we stand at their side against the terrorists?! WDR Nachrichten called them "Widerstandskämpfer".
Posted by: Gabi | May 12, 2004 at 12:14 PM
forkum wrote:
"Perhaps now the media will have a better idea of who the real enemy is in Iraq. Perhaps CNN will create an in-depth investigation into the death-worship, oppression, racism and murderous barbarism that is "systemic" to the Islamist ideology driving the terrorists. Perhaps Reuters will pen an exposé on the insurgents' "chain of command" and shine the harsh light of journalistic truth on Iran, Syria and Saudi Arabia for providing moral and material support to terrorists. Perhaps AP will ask Al Qaeda to apologize to the families of its victims. Then again, perhaps not."
the piece of "stern" that I cant avoid to read while using gmx says:
"Im Irak haben Extremisten einen entführten Amerikaner vor laufender Kamera enthauptet. Bilder davon sind auf einer El Kaida nahe stehenden Website zu sehen. Die Ermordung sei die Rache für die Folterungen irakischer Gefangener durch US-Militärs."
ie:
- german media (still) talks about "extremists" instead of excrements
- they dont mention that nick berg was a civilian
- they say "enthauptet" (beheaded) as if it was the execution of someone that really could be to blame for "tortuousness of iraqi prisoners by american military personal" not homicide
- they link to an aq-webside where they seem to be regular readers
- they are unable to write 3 phrases without to mention "t.o.i.p.b.a.m.p.", if aq nukes houston or berlin or tokyo they will still mention that it might be in retaliation for some naked bathists/sadr crooks
in this context the remarks of forkum are perfectly conclusive to me
Posted by: ch.speicher | May 12, 2004 at 12:40 PM
@Stephan,
What I am seeing in Germany is a categorical application of blame on the United States/Bush Admin for all things terrorist related. That is also what the political cartoon is addressing, in the way that it displays what (I am going to focus specifically on German Media, since my knowledge of media outlets in countries other than the U.S. and Germany does not merit my commentary) the German Media is focused on covering. Thus, although incidents like Berg and Pearl are covered, they are given the spin that phenomena like these are really somehow the fault of the encroachment of the western world, and if the United States weren't following such an aggressive policy of interventionism in the world, things like, as Gabi already mentioned, WTC, the Cole, the embassy bombings, et. al. would not be going on.
It's a perversion of blame, and it's a justification and legitimization of blowing people up.
Another thought I had on that -- We've got such horrible people like Bush and Blair infringing on the Islamic World and using military might to impose ideologies on unwilling groups of people, yet Bin Laden puts a bounty on -- Kofi "howabout you guys give ME some aid money" Annan? Should this not shed some light on the fact that no matter how the western world villifies their leaders, when it gets down to it, terrorists still just want to kill everyone there?
Posted by: Karsten | May 12, 2004 at 12:43 PM
Good article by Walid Phares:
www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=13359
Posted by: Hartmut | May 12, 2004 at 01:14 PM
Hartmut,
Thanks for this article! Do we have anything like this in Germany? Perhaps Herzinger in der ZEIT tomorrow? Or Leon de Winter, Michael Stürmer. This is what we need.
Walid Phares wrote: "The pictures of his murder will circle the world – and they deserve to overshadow the Abu Ghraib photos." I am afraid this won't happen in Germany and in Europe and in the Arabic world. This is shameful and it is wrong and dangerous.
I am a coward, I am a woman. These terrorists frighten me and I think it was a young brave man. I am sad that he had to die.
Posted by: Gabi | May 12, 2004 at 02:43 PM
Gerade ein Medienethiker auf N24, 15.00 Uhr, Prof. Funiok: Die Hinrichtung ist NICHT wesentlich schlimmer als die vorherigen Folterungen!!!! Er hofft, daß die amerikanischen Kommentatoren dies der amerikansichen Bevölkerung klarmachen.
Ich bin angeekelt, Herr Prof. Funiok.
Posted by: Gabi | May 12, 2004 at 03:07 PM
Vatican just said that the torture in Iraq is a bigger blow for America than 9/11.
Posted by: Karsten | May 12, 2004 at 03:27 PM
Während des Afghanistan-Krieges in den 80er Jahren wurden auch schon Filme von Tötungen gefangener oder verwundeter russischer Soldaten gemacht und bis heute zu Propaganda- und Rekrutierungszwecken eingesetzt.
Nachfolgend, aus einem Artikel in der LA Times vom 23.September 2002: von der Polizei abgehörte Gespräche zwischen Islamisten in Italien (Auszug).
The way other men might watch pornography, they sat in a seedy apartment chortling at videos of moujahedeen slaughtering Russian soldiers in the snows of Chechnya. "Look, look how they cut his throat," a suspect named Khaled exclaimed, according to the transcript of an intercept March 22, 2001, in an apartment in suburban Gallarate.
"Why's the other one alive?" a man named Farid said as gunfire from the television echoed in the background. "Now they are getting ready to burn," Khaled said. He started reminiscing about his own combat experiences in Chechnya. [....]Turning back to the video, Farid marveled: "This cassette is really scary.... You can see the [Russian] commandos realize they are having their throats cut by real soldiers.... The best commandos in the world would tremble if they saw this."
Dann waren da noch Daniel Pearl und Fabrizio Quattrocchi - und zweifellos noch andere. Was sagt wohl der Herr Prof. Medienethiker dazu? Was ist das überhaupt für ein Beruf und warum leben solche Leute von meinen Steuergeldern?
Posted by: werner | May 12, 2004 at 03:30 PM
Good media link. If it will not open worth the effort to sign up to read it. LA Times will not follow you with junk mail or open you to spam. You also get access to the Chicago Tribune with the same nick and password.
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-herschensohn12may12,1,4021093.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions
Posted by: Joe | May 12, 2004 at 03:33 PM
Der Medienethiker sagt also, die Hinrichtung ist nicht schlimmer als die Mißhandlungen. Dann wäre die Rache für die Hinrichtung, z.B. die Erschießung von ein paar Gefangenen, wohl auch nicht schlimmer. Unser Medienethiker müßte sich mal mit einem Friedensforscher unterhalten. Der würde ihm dann erklären, wo das Ganze endet: in einer Spirale der Gewalt!!
Was täten wir ohne unsere Experten. Vielleicht sollten wir ein paar davon mit dem Fallschirm über dem Irak abwerfen?
Posted by: werner | May 12, 2004 at 03:42 PM
I know so little about how German media functions. In the US you can if you chose write letters to the editor. Some times depending both on content, how well the letter is written and the point of view or views that are appearing on the editorial pages yours might actually get published.
I think a topic for a letter to a German newspaper would be something along these lines.
In the past week the world has witnessed two events, the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by US personnel and the beheading of a civilian. Each of these events presents horrible acts.
Now that Germany has witnessed these two events and how each was handled by the organization, which did them, which world do the Germans want to live in?
Is to be a world where al-Quada rules and laws and values apply or a world where US rules and laws and values apply.
These really are the gut level choices that the German people have to make. If they think they will not have to make these, then they will be made for them. The question then becomes who will make the choice if not the German people
Posted by: Joe | May 12, 2004 at 03:51 PM
Spiegel Online ist scheinbar bereist "durch" mit dem Thema. Der Mord an Berg taucht jetzt nur noch irgendwo unten hinter dem Papst, Ufos und einem Nacktmull auf. Es ist unglaublich.
Posted by: Thomas | May 12, 2004 at 03:58 PM
Great article, Joe.
"In fairness, there is an alternative to our involvement in the war against terrorism, and that is to leave our fate to the international community under the United Nations. Yes, the U.N. can bring about peace: the peace of the palace for the few in authority, the peace of subjugation for the many and the peace of mass graves for the courageous.
The only subject worthy of our national attention and the only pursuit that should be acceptable is total victory — no matter if others are offended or even destroyed. I know this kind of thinking is not considered acceptable in 2004. But we better accept it — and quickly. And if we make it our only cause and unconditional victory is achieved, our leadership and our troops and our home-front supporters of their mission will be known as another "Greatest Generation."
N 24 macht jetzt eine Telefonumfrage:
"Folter und Enthauptung im Irak. Bekommen die USA die Situation im Irak noch in den Griff?"
Man kann telefonisch abstimmen.
Ist das nicht zynisch?
Posted by: Gabi | May 12, 2004 at 04:07 PM
zeit.de:
Kommentare
Irak: Wohin führt dieser Krieg?
Im Irak spitzt sich die Spirale der Gewalt zu. Nach Aussagen der US-Soldatin Lynndie England, die auf Fotos bei Misshandlungen von irakischen Gefangenen zu sehen ist, wiesen ranghöhere Offiziere der US-Armee die Folterungen an. Und nun dies: Al-Qaida-Terroristen enthaupteten auf bestialische Weise einen Amerikaner, der in den Irak gereist war, um sich am Wiederaufbau des Landes zu beteiligen. Wohin führt dieser Krieg und mit welchen Mitteln kann der Irak befriedet werden?
2004-05-12 14:15:17
Warum erwähnen Sie in Ihrer Fragestellung nicht die gestrige öffentliche Aussage des US-Generals Tabuga, dessen schonungslose Aufklärung über den Abu-Ghreib-Skandal bisher vor allem durch Offenheit und ehrliche Suche nach der Wahrheit von sich reden machte, was auch im NEW YORKER-Artikel von Seymour Hersh so vermittelt wird? General Tabuga sagte zwar, daß die Armeestrukturen schuld an dem Folterskandal sind(durch mangelnde Disziplin und fehlende Dienstaufsicht der verantwortlichen Offiziere), betonte aber zugleich, daß nach seinen Erkenntnissen die folternden Soldaten aus eigenem Antrieb ihre Untaten begingen und daß für ein systematisches, von höchster Stelle befohlenes Foltern keine Beweise gefunden werden konnten.
Wem glaubt die Redaktion der ZEIT mehr, der Sadistin Lynndie Englund, die versucht, ihren Kopf aus der Schlinge zu ziehen, oder einem angesehenen General, der durch seine Ermittlungen wesentlich zur Aufklärung dieses Skandals beitrug und sich dabei auch nicht scheute, sich bei Kollegen und Vorgesetzten unbeliebt zu machen? Die Formulierung Ihrer Frage ist ein weiteres gutes Beispiel für die Voreingenommenheit deutscher Medien(leider auch der ZEIT) und für journalistisches Versagen!
B.S.
Posted by: no more time | May 12, 2004 at 04:27 PM
Enthauptung
Bush am Pranger
Nach Meinung der Familie von Nick Berg, der vor laufenden Kameras geköpft wurde, trifft die US-Regierung eine gewisse Mitschuld..
focus.de
Posted by: marabut | May 12, 2004 at 07:12 PM
Ich tue das wahrlich selten, aber heute muß ich RTL loben. Keine Seitenhiebe auf Bush, klare Worte für die Tat, Schwerpunkt der Berichte auf dem Mord und nicht auf den US-Folterungen, den Begriff "Rache" nur als Zitat der Täter gebraucht und auf die klare Ablehnung der meisten Iraker hingewiesen.
Im ZDF vorhin dagegen leider wieder die alte Leier: mehr über Abu Ghraib als den Mord, die Tat als Rache (untermauert durch Interviews mit Irakern, die die Tat zwar ablehnen, aber als Rache interpretieren), Vorwürfe an die Regierung, "Eskalation" des Krieges etc. pp.
Posted by: Thomas | May 12, 2004 at 07:27 PM
Und der Papst hat den Früchtekorb gewonnnen:"Die Folterbilder sind schlimmer als der 11. September." Nur weil Amerikaner folterten.
Dann die alte Leier UNO, bla, bla, bla.
Jemand, der einen Mörder wie Tariq Aziz die Hand gibt, hat keine moralische Glaubwürdigkeit.
Seit den Foltervorwürfen muss ja jetzt jeder seinen Senf abgeben, Erler, Müntefering, Bütikoffer.
Habe übrigens mit vielen Irakern gesprochen und die meinten alle übereinstimmend : "Das war gar keine Folter, ein bisschen Vorspeise zur tatsächlichen Folter." Ach ja, die meisten Iraker vermissen das "ehrliche Engagement" der Araber und der Europäer für Iraker zu Saddam´s Zeiten.
Europa hat gar keine moralisch Glaubwürdigkeit im Irak, deswegen sollten sie Schlaubischlümpfe die Kirche im Dorf lassen.
P.S.: die Genfer Konvention kennt den Unterschied zwischen Demütigung und Folter. Der Papst & Deutschland nicht.
Posted by: Samir al-Iraqi | May 12, 2004 at 08:10 PM
Here is the take of the Germans. It was not unexpected. It displays the morale monopoly Germany retains for herself. It is appearly clear this is part of the ground work being laid for the Germans to live in the world of the laws, ideals, and values of al-Qaida. It is one more reason the US should leave Europe.
http://www.dw-world.de/english/0,3367,7549_A_1200745_1_A,00.html
Posted by: Joe | May 12, 2004 at 09:18 PM
I know at times we all struggle with what words mean. We have done this with words like abuse and torture and even terror.
Well to help clear this up I am going to add to the definition of terror.
Terror - for democrats and Klink and the European elites - a second Bush term as President.
Posted by: Joe | May 12, 2004 at 09:27 PM
NOBODY in europe listen to the pope when he talks about
- abortion,
- condoms and HIV,
- homosexuality,
- or contraception
and I think its a very GOOD thing that nobody wants to have HIS live ruined by him,
if it comes to cloning (huh :O) or his arab and cuban dictator friends and his aversion against jews and america, well THATS of course a different case for the left, cause there just OTHER peoples lives getting ruined,
the pope is therefore one of my MOST favourite "foad"-characters,
"tiiime is on my side" ;)
Posted by: ch.speicher | May 12, 2004 at 09:39 PM
How long is it going to take the Left or maybe even the Right in Germany to declare this beheading as something the Americans just faked and did themselves. This time to regain support for their unjust war.
Much like 9 11 was something the Americans did to justify going to war in the first place.
Posted by: Joe | May 12, 2004 at 09:48 PM
joe wrote
"How long is it going to take the Left or maybe even the Right in Germany to declare this beheading as something the Americans just faked and did themselves."
they just have to wait for a state owned newspaper in saudi arabia to say it (they already informed the world that AQ and SHIA are in fact jewish conspiracies), then spon can write an encouraging articel about it and it can be discussed on jihad-tv (wdr can make a sequel to their former 9/11 disclosures), I m quite sure it actually WILL happen this way (and I was right before when I sarcastically pronounced in a letter to the editors of the same saudi newspaper that SUUURE the juuuus had their fiiilthy hands in the riad bombings, these guys are quite predictable in their understanding of FREE press :D)
Posted by: ch.speicher | May 12, 2004 at 10:15 PM
@Klink,
I was reading some Big Media comments today and the tone of them reminded me of an exchange of postings we had a week or so ago.
If I remember correctly you were posting about how secretive the Bush Administration was. You even found a couple of articles that went along the line of “Tell us Mr. President. We can handle it.”
Well it seems the Big Media you so champion in the US decided that we could not handle it. They chose not to show the video of the beheading. No newspaper showed one of the barbarians holding the head a loft for the world to see.
It seems Big Media gets to choose what we can handle and what we cannot handle. As they are our own liberal elites airing the video of the beheading does not support their agenda.
So much for being secretive.
Posted by: Joe | May 12, 2004 at 10:31 PM
Well it seems the Big Media you so champion in the US decided that we could not handle it. They chose not to show the video of the beheading. No newspaper showed one of the barbarians holding the head a loft for the world to see.
This video was so graphic and hard to stomach that I can understand hesitation in this instance. Peter Jennings rolling this tape at 6:30 pm Pacific Time, right at dinner perhaps with kids around?
Did you note that even David shied away from posting a link to the video, just indirectly a link which then linked to stills only?
I am myself all for getting it out: Show the brutality of these terrorists, so that people will understand that terrorism is a serious issue. Euronews-channel here actually showed the first couple of seconds of the actual killing. (and before someone asks again if I changed my mind: No. Iraq != terrorism. Zarqawi and his deadly goons have been around longer and would seize any fig-leaf for their heinous crimes)
Posted by: Klink | May 12, 2004 at 11:41 PM
David appears to be in general opposed to showing the horrors happening to "our" side and instead decries that for example the pictures of Terror-Sheik Yassin weren't bloody enough? From an earlier thread here:
While SPIEGEL ONLINE shows pictures of mutilated and burned corpses of murdered Americans in Fallujah in graphic detail (SPIEGEL ONLINE even criticizes the American media for not presenting these terrible pictures), the pictural presentation of Sheik Yassin's death is much more distanced and respectful.
I already disagreed with David back then - and cited the Israeli Defense Force releasing a graphic video as well. Check my reply in that thread at: Posted by: Col. Klink | April 1, 2004 10:35 nachm.. Any extra words would be redundant.
Note from David: Confusing, Klink. Don't get your point.
Anyway, this blog is not a news outlet, giving equal consideration to everything that happens everywhere. My topic is "Politically incorrect observations on the German media". "Politically incorrect" in the German media context means: German media watch from a conservative-libertarian point of view. That's all.
You want a different focus? Start your own blog! I'll be happy to frequently contribute my comments...
Posted by: Klink | May 12, 2004 at 11:59 PM
Folgenden Kommentar erhielt ich soeben in meinem Blog auf einen Artikel, in dem ich Spiegel-Berichterstattung über den Mord an Nick Berg als zu beiläufig kritisiert habe:
---
Tach, gut dass du dieses Thema thematisierst. Wird Zeit, dass die Araber gleichsetzen...obwohl andere Lösungen sicherlich sinnvoller gewesen wären.
Ich beobachte das Ganze schon eine Weile...spätesntens seit dem 11.September, der eigentlich keiner war.
Zuviele Ungereimtheiten, zuviele Lügen, zu oft verschleiert, verheimlicht usw. Wer jemals glaubte, die Araber liessen so etwas ungesühnt mit sich machen (ich meine lange vor den herabwürdigenden Bildern) , der täuscht sich.
Außerdem wüsste ich spontan von keinem Imperium, dass sich derart weit aus dem Fenster lehnte und nicht irgenwann das Gleichgewicht verlor. Inshallah...so Gott will!
Allahuakbar
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Traurig, oder?
Posted by: Thomas | May 13, 2004 at 12:09 AM
Seems once again Big Media gets a pass. Bush always the bad guy.
People wonder why Big Media has such little effect and held at the same level of comtemp as used car salesmen in the US.
For those of you who might be confused about this Americans have little use for elites be they ours or European. This is one difference in the values between Europe and the US.
Posted by: Joe | May 13, 2004 at 12:09 AM
Fragen wir uns war mal ganz einfach:
Was gibts neues im TV?
1. Statt Al Jazeera wird jetzt das Internet als Medien-Plattform genutzt.
2. Das ganze Geschehen wird etwas grausamer. Na ja, die Foltervideos, die das Pentagon momentan noch unter Verschluss hält, sind halt "präventiv" zu toppen.
3. Nun muss auch langsam dem letzten Kartoffelbauern in Iowa klar werden, dass er seit 15 Monaten über das wahre Kriegsgeschehen im Irak von seiner Regierung vollkommen verarscht wird.
4. Die US-Medien laufen Amok. Zwischen Profitgier (wer zeigt zuerst das grässslichste Video), Patriotismus (lässt sich hiermit überhaupt noch Kohle machen???) und dem eingeübten Lagerdenken weiss nun wohl keiner mehr, was er den nächsten Tag drucken oder senden soll.
5. Selbst mit meinen jämmerlichen Arabisch-Kenntnissen: was sich da zusammenbraut (schon allein anhand der Wortwahl in den Medien) ist definitiv zum fürchten. Wenn demnächst die NY Subway pulverisiert wird, würde es mich nicht wundern.
Posted by: Jean-Paul | May 13, 2004 at 01:32 AM
Jean-Paul wrote:
"3. Nun muss auch langsam dem letzten Kartoffelbauern in Iowa klar werden, dass er seit 15 Monaten über das wahre Kriegsgeschehen im Irak von seiner Regierung vollkommen verarscht wird".
Und was, wenn du verarscht wurdest?
Posted by: Gerd | May 13, 2004 at 07:38 AM
Herr Kamann, danke für diesen Beitrag. Sie wissen es, wir hier wissen es, aber nicht die Vielzahl der Journalisten hier in Deutschland:
Wettlauf des Grauens
Der Kommentar
von Matthias Kamann
Erst die Fotos von den Misshandlungen, jetzt das Video von der Enthauptung. Schreckensbild folgt auf Schreckensbild, und wir Medienkonsumenten meinen, da müsse ein moralischer Zusammenhang bestehen. Den gibt es aber nicht: Die Bestialität der Terroristen ist nicht die Folge des Sadismus in Abu Ghraib.
http://www.welt.de/data/2004/05/13/277327.html
Posted by: Gabi | May 13, 2004 at 12:32 PM
Note from David: Confusing, Klink. Don't get your point.
Janz eenfach: Du hast SPIEGEL dafür kritisiert, daß er westliche Opfer ausführlich zeigte, den Terror-Scheich aber nur aus der Ferne.
Doch genau so herum ist es richtig: Denn die Brutalität einer Tat aus der Nähe zu zeigen erzeugt Gefühle, und wir wollen solche Gefühle eher bei Opfern auf unserer Seite als bei Terroristen.
Wenn man also "Blut-Bilder" zeigt, dann eher solche, die einem unschuldigen zivilen Opfer wie Nick Berg oder Bombenopfern wiederfuhr als einen toten Terror-Scheich aus der Nähe zu zeigen.
Umgekehrt wäre es genau falsch.
Posted by: Klink | May 13, 2004 at 03:05 PM
LOL. widerfuhr mit ie - au weia. ;-)
Posted by: Klink | May 13, 2004 at 03:09 PM
Matthias Kamann also wrote
"Insofern hat der Vatikan mit der provokanten Äußerung, die Folterungen hätten den USA mehr geschadet als der 11. September, nicht Unrecht: Die Misshandlungen haben die USA beschädigt; diese geraten in ein Wechselspiel der Brutalitäten. Wie es scheint, ist es noch nicht zu Ende."
I dont agree,
cause
- the vatican should be more concerned about burning churches in sudan (maybe the people there are damned protestants?) and/or rapists that are Catholic priests in their second job,
- the enemy (militant islam) dont cares for the nacked prisoners, cause he has a very different idea of "weakness" than inhumanity and sadism, all "muslim furor" is IMO just a bad joke, if they get the opportunity they will kill us (all "infidels" and "collaborators") anyhow
- most americans still trust their president and the army (the polls are 2:1 in favour of rummy), they are mad on the sadistic assholes that actualy did the prisoner abuse, but dont blame western civilisation
- samir and the iraqi bloggers also made their point (not that the vatican gave a shit for them when it was saddam that did the REAL torture or that the vatican gave a shit for them now)
- the LLL anti-war crowd finally thinks anyway the whole war had only the aim to kill as much as possible muslim babies and steal from poor "colered" people, so what the tizzy about a little s/m
/*btw:
I guess that in former times (ie after ww2) insurgents wouldnt have made it to prison - abuse - compensation, but were simply shout (insurgents are no POW)*/
hence the vatican being more concerned about pornography/prisoner abuse than about the dead of 3000 innocent non-combatants is not "provoking" but disgusting
Posted by: ch.speicher | May 13, 2004 at 08:38 PM
@ ch.speicher
Ja, wer solche Freunde hat wie den Vatikan und Aussenminister Fischer, braucht keine Feinde mehr. Sieht man ja an den Folteropfer.
@ Jean-Paul
Kann es sein, dass du nach 30 Monaten DAuerberieselung von Saddam, Bush, WMD, Öl und die bösen Amis auch verarscht wurdest.
Und welche Sprüche auf Arabisch sind zum Fürchten, würde mich genauer interessieren.
Ich frage, weil die arabische Rhetorik nie den Anschluss an die Moderne geschafft hat, auf einen mittelalterlich-religiösen Grund aufbaut und degeneriert ist. Wer darauf reinfällt, ist selbst schuld, wobei hier mehrere Faktoren sich an einander bedingen. Auf jeden Fall, welche Wortwahl ? (meine addresse ist ja da.)
Posted by: Samir al-Iraqi | May 15, 2004 at 03:12 PM
Ch.Speicher- "most americans still trust their president and the army (the polls are 2:1 in favour of rummy), they are mad on the sadistic assholes that actualy did the prisoner abuse, but dont blame western civilisation"
Well explained. We regard the sadistic assholes responsible for their own acts, even if ordered. US military are obligated to disobey illegal orders. They swear their service oath to protect and defend the US Constitution, and "cruel and unusual punishment" is most decidedly unConstitutional. It doesn't take a Constitutional lawyer to know that, either... any 10-year old who has ever watched a police TV show knows that.
Ch.Speicher- "samir and the iraqi bloggers also made their point (not that the vatican gave a shit for them when it was saddam that did the REAL torture or that the vatican gave a shit for them now)"
I've been keeping tabs on the Iraqi bloggers, too. Some of them are a real breath of fresh air in the world! :)
Ch.Speicher- "the LLL anti-war crowd finally thinks anyway the whole war had only the aim to kill as much as possible muslim babies and steal from poor "colered" people, so what the tizzy about a little s/m"
And I've always wondered how they "know" all of this. It isn't a part of the US track record. Are they psychic, so that they can "know" what the US government is planning ahead of time? Are they channeling Edgar Cayce? Curious logic!
Posted by: Theresa, Florida | May 17, 2004 at 07:44 AM