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Comments

When will we make certain German journalists pay for their sickening bias??????

For something to be funny, there has to be an element of truth. There is no truth to this attempt at humor, which is why it's not funny, just boring.

Via Bros. Judd:

(Typical lefties, Mickey Mousing around while Germany's falling down around them cos they can't admit we're right) at forbes.com

Current Events
Germany's Dismal Future
Paul Johnson, 01.31.05, 12:00 AM ET

SNIP--

Three Reasons for Germany's Decline
• The power wielded by its old-fashioned trade unions. German unions insist on short hours, high wages, immense social security benefits and conditions of work that make productivity increases virtually impossible. Their stranglehold on the economy is akin to that exercised by British unions before Margaret Thatcher smashed them in the early 1980s.

• The input of the EU bureaucracy in Brussels. The EU imposes endless rules, whose net effect is to stifle enterprise and squelch innovation. The push toward a European superstate has proved an unmitigated disaster for Germany, which, despite its relative economic decline, is still the biggest net contributor to EU funds. Germany thus ends up financing programs such as the Common Agricultural Policy that work against its interests. Germany pays the EU piper, while France calls all the tunes.

Indeed, Germany's subservience to France is one of the most astonishing and inexplicable features of today's world. Chancellor Gerhard Schröder seems content to play the poodle to President Jacques Chirac in the most humiliating and grovelling way, following tamely in courses that demonstrably work against Germany both at home and abroad.

When Germany looked to U.S. leadership between 1950 and the early 1970s, it prospered. Since Germany submitted to French direction, the country has plunged relentlessly into the pit. Sooner or later the German people are going to grasp this salient truth; when they do, the consequences for Europe will be dramatic. This moment has been delayed, however, by the third factor in the nation's decline.

• Germany's acute sense of failure and unhappiness. This is a collective psychological depression that effectively prevents Germany from taking action to remedy its ills. The Germans agree they're in a mess, and many see the obvious way out. The country needs to make the kinds of structural changes in its economy that Prime Minister Thatcher carried out in Britian 20 years ago, changes that have completely transformed the performance and expectations of the British people. But though most Germans know this, they lack the will--and, of course, the leadership--to carry it out. They stay inert, supine, transfixed by fear and angst, paralyzed by the thought of painful adjustments in their safety-first society--and thus coast toward a disaster comparable to Hitlerism.

Germany's demographic structure reinforces all the weaknesses of its stagnant society and economy. It has one of the world's lowest birthrates, a rapidly aging population and a calamitously expensive social security system, all of which combine to project a dark and dangerous future. Germany faces not merely a net decline in population--from 80 million to 60 million--by midcentury, but a lowering of living standards and the unrest that will surely follow.

SNIP

Your Article about the "Sueddeutsche Zeitung" was most interesting.

I am married to a beautiful German lady I met while serving in the Army in Germany in 1960.

She still has family living in Germany, a brother and sister.

Her sister is presently visiting us here in Texas. When the topic turns to politics she states that she is very conservative and votes for the CDU. However when the topic turns to our President, George W. Bush, she cannot understand how we can support him. She recites all of the stories she reads in the German Media to substantuate how really bad he is as a President.

My wfe and I will retort with facts and figures and give her alternate reading material

After several days she came to me and stated that she could not believe how one sided the German media was and what a one sided picture they were getting.

This is a woman who has a colledge education and comes from an outstanding family who consideres themselves conservative. Can you imagine what a liberal person in Germany thinks after such contact with such a leberal media?

I don't think there is much one can do about this picture, other than what you are doing. My sister-in-law will read your Blog religiously when she returns to Germany.

I think this clearly shows just what a bias media and/or press can do. I knew all along what you were saying was true, but when it comes home in such a personl way, it really has impact.

Perhaps there is no cure for this, but a least you have taken a first step and no other will follow unless that first step is taken. Lets hope many will follow.

In a way, you are becoming the Rush Limbaugh
of Blogs in Germany.

I would ask how one can find your site in German, she would much prefer to read you "kritik" in her native language.

Keep up the good work

Dick

@ Dick,

Wow. Reading a comment like that makes it all worth it. That is the reason we do what we do. It also confirms what we have been talking about here on our blog day for day. As for German language, we hope to start something like that in the near future. Of course we will need some help as it is hard enough for David and myself just to keep this site running.

Thank you so much again.

---Ray D.

@ Scuderia Austria: "...make certain German journalists pay..."? "Pay"?? As in...? Would you care to elaborate? Or, rather, NOT: please keep this kind of BS to yourself. I don't think this is the place for such talk.

@ Richard E. Sykes: Calling David's venerable Blog "the Rush Limbaugh of Blogs in Germany" isn't very nice. Next thing someone will call it "the german Little Green Footballs". However much i may disagree with many of the sentiments expressed here: the "Medienkritik" is (and will hopefully stay) a bit above Limbaugh and Footballs.

@sandy P.
you made me laugh with your bullshit you wrote about the DARK german future....... alway nice to see another dumb american here!

I didn't write it - so who's the dumb one, anonymous?

At least I have enough guts to ID myself.

@Anomynous:

SPON has a good article that supports the theory of German decline:

A 55 year-old woman and her two adult children were arrested the other day. Apparently, OPA, age 79, died 3 years ago. His daughter stuffed his body into a "bio recycling bin" and hid him on the veranda for 3 years so that his social security checks would still keep coming.

The story supports two premises:

1st, Germans are over-dependent on welfare. (In this case, over-dependent on their parent's welfare)

2nd, Germans take recycling way to serious.

Just for the record: i don't know who " " is, but it's not me. I posted under the nick "Anonymous Comment" because i'm neither ready nor willing to handle flames or spam via e-mail. Make commenting to "Medienkritik" registered-only and i might reconsider.

1933 - Nach der Ernennung Hitlers zum Reichskanzler entschließt sich Einstein, der bereits zuvor massiven antisemitischen Angriffen ausgesetzt war, zur Emigration in die USA, wo er am Institute for Advanced Study in Princeton (US-Staat New Jersey) wirkt. Er wird nie wieder deutschen Boden betreten.

Tagesspiegel erwähnt es in der Chronologie. Wenn Deutschland Einstein feiert, sollte auch dieses Thema sein und zwar ein großes.

President Bush led the United States into four wars, oversaw the dismantling of Social Security and Medicare, ...please let that come true, I can't afford much more of this... and enforced a drastic shrinking of elementary, secondary, and collegiate education....The Federal Government has no business in education anyway...He spearheaded the transformation of President Bill Clinton's budget surpluses of 1999 and 2000 into permanent deficits of more than a trillion dollars a year,...Those surpluses were due to the work of the American people, not the efforts of one man-child...

Following his reelection in 2004, Mr. Bush ordered the destruction of the cities where the insurgents...(terrorists)...,were thought to be concentrated;...good...though the cities were destroyed, the insurgency...(terrorism)... continued....Unlikely...Mr. Bush then pressed on to Iran and North Korea, which he had identified as "rogue...(terrorist)...states."...Innocent kite-flyers all, I'm sure...

The war, according to the United Nations, caused the deaths of 12 million people...where..? and the displacement of millions more....How many Westerners were saved..?Mr. Bush's claim in action if not in words that the United States retained an international monopoly on the legitimate use of force left the United States at least formally unchallenged ...GOOD..!

Thanks for letting me vent.

What happens when Hillary becomes President in a mere 1460 days? Do we (Americans) all suddenly become saints?

She may be the one to push the button.

The global Leftist media, those that follow the leftist religion that murdered 174 Million people and invented the Purge the Progrom the mass Grave and the gulag, what else should we expect.

The leftist media seems to have on the agenda manufacuring hate between the peoples of Europe and the United States.

Not that they care mind you, we already know that are utterly totally irresponsible.

Walter Durranty's all of them (the NYT reporter that helped stalin murder 10 Million people in the UKraine).

At least in the USA, the media is no longer trusted, Americans generally know that their leftist media is noting but malignant propaganda.

One worries about the peoples of Europe however, they still seem to be immersed in the leftist propaganda matrix, and a souless society that can no longer identify, much less Judge, right from wrong.

Mass graves of Children in Iraq, found still holding their toys ? ... kidnapped 14 year olds used for sex toys then tiger food ? according to the left, the rule of those monsters should have continued, another Socialist dictator, the PolPot of Babylon, and to the left, the evil was in deposing of the monsters.

This is objective truth, objective proof, that Geroge Orwells Nightmare rules in Europe.

Now their agenda, is manufacture of hate against Americans, the same way they are manufacuring Hate against the Jews.

A situation that cannot continue for long without dire effect.

Do the leftist stooges not know that when they attack Our president in THIS manner, that they are attacking US ?

That is certainly how it it will be interpeted by the Majority of America.

Did not Gobeles hang for his crimes ?

As the leftist agenda of manufacturing distrust and conflict with America becomes successfull, those responsible would have earned the same punishment.

"You TELL The Americans..."
http://newsisyphus.blogspot.com/2005/01/word-from-paris-you-tell-americans.html

"When you get home you TELL the Americans God bless George Bush and God bless the United States of America. You tell them not to believe everything they read in the newspapers, and that there are plenty French who think this. He is the best man for the job in the dangerous time we have now. You TELL them."

Perhaps, due to a few, that seem immune to the brainwashing, there is hope.


@ Ray D.
Ray, I am thinking along the same lines, it is important to get more German readers to this Blog, hence do more in German.
Any help you need, let me know. I am born German and proud US citizen since 2002!!
JR

@Raymond
You are absolutely right; the monster that must ultimately be slain is Leftism.

As to the article by Griel Marcus, I welcome its publication in the Sueddeutsche Zeitung. The reelection of President Bush was a profoundly bitter disappointment for the worldwide Left, a movement so convinced of its intellectual and moral superiority is bound to be enraged by four more years of utter powerlessness. The rantings of Mr. Marcus give them an opportunity to vent their anger; by discussing and imagining events that have never, nor will ever, occur, they can reaffirm their belief that they are intelligent and good, while Bush is stupid and evil. Sort of like Hillary talking to Eleanor Roosevelt on the roof of the White House.

The fantasies of Mr. Marcus also give us a much needed glimpse into the deluded Leftist mind set. The tone of the article - the full-length version of which also includes the Bush daughters dying in a car accident and Laura dying of Parkinson's disease - and the accompanying illustration reveal an intense and irrational loathing that is truly disturbing. Even if one were to agree - which no rational person would - that everyone killed in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were somehow murdered by Bush, that still wouldn't come close to the number of people killed by Saddam or the Taliban, but I don't recall this sort of hatred directed at them by anyone on the Left. Just imagine if these people had the power to act out their odius fury.

This weblog focuses primarily with anti-Americanism in the German media, which is good, because someone needs to keep tabs on the German media, as pointed out above by Dick.

Nevertheless, by focusing on the German media, some context gets lost. We should keep in mind that the media here gets lots of food from the American media. While Mr. Marcus was publishing his fantasies in the Sueddeutsche, Leftists in the American media were busy with worse projects:
http://powerlineblog.com/archives/009249.php
http://powerlineblog.com/archives/009245.php

Yes he has an imagine problem in most countries in the world but FOR WHAT HE HAS DONE. The German Media, like that of other countries, has climbed on board to make the situation worse, but no matter how much you complain about biased German media, it doesn't change an illegal war in Iraq, ignoring the Geneva Conventions and the United Nations. Regardless of what you think of the UN or Geneva conventions, a lot of people still find them important.

J Davis

"llegal war in Iraq, ignoring the Geneva Conventions and the United Nations. Regardless of what you think of the UN or Geneva conventions, a lot of people still find them important."

Typcal leftist sludge

"Illegal War" an oxymoron with a double twist.

Illegal according to who ? God ?

United Nations, A joke, Syria head of human rights = UN is no longer to be paid attention to, funding should be cut off, the US should get out of the UN and the UN, guilty of genocide rape and theft, kicked off US soil.

Geneva Conventions do not apply to terrorists, the only reason you would not shoot them on the spot is to get possible information, otherwise its proper to just shoot them.

This is what the Geneva Conventions say, because when combatents mix with civilians thay put at risk civilians, and thats why the Geneva Conventions provide NO, NONE, protection to terrorists. who, should be shot, as soon as they are no longer usefull to us.

How typical for a leftist to be so ignorant.

@J Davis
The excitable Left hated Bush before he ever took office, so you can strike those big bold letters from your post. And we complain about the German media precisely because it has worked to convince Germans that the US has conducted "an illegal war in Iraq, ignoring the Geneva Conventions and the United Nations."

Exactly what 'law' did the war in Iraq violate? There is no law that obligates the US to coddle brutal dictators to protect French, Russian and Chinese financial interests. The Iraqis routinely perpetrated acts of war by attacking US air patrols in the no-fly zones in Iraq. Bush did not ignore the UN (though he should have); he in fact worked diligently within the UN to try and get weapons inspectors back into Iraq as agreed upon in the 1991 CEASE FIRE, and to get Saddam brought to justice. Nor have the Geneva Conventions been ignored. A few prison guards may have gone too far, but they have been and are being prosecuted. The prisoners at Guantanamo Bay do not fall under the Geneva Conventions because they are not uniformed enemy combatants.

I agree that there have been some mistakes made and that there have been some excesses, but by the standards the German media sets out for the US, every country would be guilty of war crimes. And even if your assertions were true, it would not explain the intensity of the hatred directed at President Bush and the US by the German Left.

The quotes provided above do not seem too bad to me. At least it looks like the author merely disagrees with GWB's politics. He seems to expect the worst. The really tasteless part of the article comes later. How about this one?

"Mr. Bush's life after his presidency was marked by misfortune. He soon lost interest in his status as the standard-bearer of his party and its chief fundraiser; many believed he had again begun drinking, and in any case he seemed to spend most of his time at private clubs in Houston, where he established residence in 2010 after selling his property in Crawford, Texas. ("At least I won't have to cut that f--- brush again," Mr. Bush was heard to say after his last election.) Then on May 1, 2011, Jenna and Barbara Bush were killed in a drunken driving accident in New York City, an incident that also took the lives of seven other people, four of them friends of the Bush daughters. Rumors that a Bush family friend attempted to bribe the police to report that a person other than Jenna or Barbara Bush was driving (the body of Barbara Bush was in the driver's seat) were never confirmed. Four years later, in 2015, Laura Bush, like her father, died of Parkinson's disease; she was 68."

judge for yourself

But you do know difference between a newspaper article and a comment, don't you? Comments like that are supposed to be exaggerated and they only reflect the viewpoint of the author not of the whole newspaper.


beimami

Exactly,

And the reason why the military is pressing charges is that such act tarnish the reputation of the United States, all good people know our standards, and understand why we take a dim view of any of our troops that violate them.

But "Geneva Conventions" for terrorists head choppers and baby killers ?

Ive read the blogged rage of marines climbing on rooftops to pick up childrens body parts after a jihadi blows up a school bus, probably the same way the jews feel.

No .. and im not sorry, those that deliberatly target kids are the same monsters that created mass graves of Iraqi kids and the same monsters that target jewish Kids or the school Kids in beslan

Even mention "Geneva Convention" in connection with those kinds of monsters and it proves you are the same monster.

An enemy of humanity that should be exterminated.

@phil

I couldn't agree with you more. I can understand if people don't agree with Bush and his policies. Painting a picture of how his policies go south is also acceptable. But I do not understand how one could in my opinion hate another human being so much to fabricate the death of his children. No matter what the politics it seems to me that decency dictates that one would wish for other peoples children that they live out their lives i.e. get old healthy!! This part of the article goes over the line and in my opinion shows the author's true charachter. Politician's kids are off limits.

As far as the rest of the article is concerned, well I think it is a sign of how successful Bush is and how freightened and desperate the left is becoming.

Dean has my vote!!

I am really so disheartened by this. I lived in Germany for a year while studying the language and I loved it. Some of my fondest memories are of the country, its people and the culture. The friends I made there are my some of my closest friends to this day and will be as long as I live.
No country is perfect, and no one in their right minds should have such expectations of anyone. The US has done its fair share of lampooning foreigners regarding Bush and more specifically about how Europe handles terrorism (however, the focus has primarily been at Chirac and to a lesser extent Russia than Germany or Schroeder).
But, at the end of the day, we Westerners have more in common than not. Perhaps it is time we come to grips with that and get on with it.
Bin Laden and his cohorts have no power to destroy us. The only force that can destroy the West is the West itself.
Given the tone and rancor of the European media and American media, it seems that is what they want to happen.

--but it's not me. I posted under the nick "Anonymous Comment" because i'm neither ready nor willing to handle flames or spam via e-mail.--

If you can't handle the flames, stay out of the kitchen. What do you think we Americans have been doing for over 3 years via this wonderful invention of Al Gore's?

And use a fake addy - DOH! Show some creativity. And when you're really ready, join in at Rantburg, your European view would be...appetizing.

Like I do. Unless I donate to this site.

Tina,

Have any examples of the American media being negative toward europe. I have yet to find anything coming remotely close to the way the elite media in europe directs its hatred toward the US, the US government or the American people.

Is Bush's image so bad because the media are biased worldwide? Or are the media biased because Bush's style and rhetorics frightens the majority of the population in almost all countries? Cause and effect are not easy to determine in this case. Remember that most of the mass media tell people what they want to hear.

The US media ignores europe for the most part

This must be really upsetting to many who still think that the world revolves around Europe still - like the Mercator projection standard flat map of the world, developed 100+ years ago and placing Germany at the center of the action.

I really do think that Europeans and American's have much much more in common than differences

But we won't be able to work together as long as the Euro media continues to taunt the US ( what a safe thing to do - try it with the Mullahs and see how brave they are )

What is their hope here anyway - that America see's the error of its ways and becomes like Europe?

God help us all if we do

David, Ray D.,


I never read the Süddeutsche, though I am living in Munich: It is a liberal newspaper, which is equivalent to: not so much my cup of tea.

Day by day you easily prove your main thesis: Anti-Americanism and the notorious anti-Bush bias are more and more distorting the image of the USA as presented by our MSM. David, you started this blog as a predominantly German blog, aiming at some useful enlightenment, at presenting pro-Bush arguments to your ill-informed GERMAN readers, at uncovering the tedious prejudices hidden behind all that moralistic and pseudo-pacifistic indignation of German journalists. To put it bluntly: You told us a truth in order to change it - the truth: Anti-Americanism is jeopardizing the german-american friendship. You have been, if you permit, a true "Transatlantiker".

But then, your blog has shifted a little bit towards your american visitors, the topic and the main thesis remained the same, the tendency and the intention not. What used to be the noble attempt to counterbalance the one-sidedness of our media in order to BRIDGE the opening cleavage between our two nations more and more came out to serve -willy-nilly, okay nilly- the opposite goal: If it is the unofficial target of the MSM to further this beginning gap, then, Ray and David, you start playing their game, you start fostering this gap. Yes, you are telling the truth, but you are not changing it (guess a blog as yours should try to), you make the truth even more true, by inspiring anger to our American friends: I think the outspoken stance of your blog would not be diluted if you would have mentioned that the WELT for example informed its online-reders in a rather neutral way about the inauguration: I do not deny the bias, you are right. Perfectly right. That is why I am a staunch friend of your blog, but: Are you sure that you still work against this truth, in favor of american-german bonds or sneakingly and without being aware of it in favor of that truth divulgating the thesis that Germany is in the grasp of an anti-american fervor, eventually evoking anti-german fervor, cutting the ties between America and Germany. We should not accept this kind of journalism (thanks for telling the truth about it), we should shun our media: But, we should decry our MSM in the name of the am.-germ. friendship, and not in the name of the opposite championing (willy-)nilly the stakes of our adversaries.

To Joe (see above),

Mind you, the media I am largely referring to is the more right of center media such as the Washington Times, NY Post, the editorial page of the WSJ and the like. The MSM is quite subservient and encouraging to the Europeans when it comes to their hatred of Bush and by extension the people of the US (the dumb herds).

I think the NY Post referred to Chirac and Co. as the Axis of Weasels. Other than this example, though, most of the right of center news does not personally attack like the MSM and European press do.

Thanks, Tina

The following was the last straw in a long series of anti-American comments in German TV that finally moved me to find and print out the hard facts for my German wife, who was only hearing half the story (the wrong half) about the US from the German media. Then I stumbled on to this blog and found that you have already been at it for a long time.
Sorry, it’s off topic, and not current, but I think its important to let people know how misguided and ill informed some of Germany’s politicians are.
-------------------------------------
Excerpt from the NTV Television talk show “2+4” Jan 4, 2005
Theme: Tsunami Disaster Aid

After introducing the guests, the first question:

Moderator:
“Nach dem Schock über das Ausmaß der Flutkatastrophe in Süd-Asien beschäftigt die Welt vor allem eine Frage: Wie kann den Opfern schnell, wirksam, und dauerhaft geholfen werden? Herr Mueller, eine der hauptbetroffenen Region, allerdings nicht so im Fokus, weil nicht touristisch, ist Aceh in Nord-Sumatra. Dort sind die Amerikaner bereits seit Tagen mit Ihren Marineeinheiten im Einsatz. Das seit Tagen geplante Bundeswehrlazarett ist immer noch nicht auf dem Weg gebracht dorthin. Warum dauert das bei uns so lange?“

Michael Mueller (stellvertretender Fraktionschef der SPD in Deutschen Bundestag):
“Also, ich will zu Ihre Positiven Anmerkungen zu den USA keinen Kommentar abgeben, weil da geht mir ehrlich gesagt ein bisschen das Messer in der Tasche auf, dass man, so zu sagen, nur in die Ölregion geht, nicht? Ich mein wir wollen es ja auf dem Punkt bringen, und das find ich schon, ehrlich gesagt, ein krummes Ding, an der UNO vorbei, und so mal wieder die eigenen Interessen zu machen. Ich will das nur sagen weil das klang mir ein bisschen zu positiv, wenn ich das sagen darf. Aber ich bedauere auch, und wir bedauern das alle, das trotz der massiven Anstrengungen, und ich weiss hier was der Krisenstab leistet, es doch in der internationalen Koordinierung schwieriger als wir gedacht haben.....…“
-------------------------------------
My comments: The moderator says that the foremost concern of the world is how to help the victims of the catastrophe and asks why Germany is slower than the US. But the foremost concern, or at least the first thing the acting leader of the ruling party in the German Parliament has to say, is to accuse the United States of going only to the oil region and side-stepping the UN to pursue its own interests.

All of us who are correctly informed know that it was the Aceh region that was hit hardest by the tsunami and in addition to that by an earthquake, and it was in the most desperate need of helicopters and landing vessels. We also know that US aid was also reaching other regions, not just the region that happened to have oil. Does Herr Mueller think that US forces should not have gone to Aceh, thus leaving thousands of homeless and injured people completely cut off from aid, without food or potable water in destroyed coastal villages and cities? I don’t think so.

All of us who are correctly informed also know that the UN was not immediately capable of coordinating such an enormous relief effort. Does Herr Mueller think that the US should have sat around doing nothing while waiting for the UN to figure out how to coordinate everything? I don’t think so.

Then why is he using a public debate about tsunami disaster aid to make unfounded accusations against the US?
The answer to this question is given by Herr Mueller himself:
“Ich will das nur sagen weil das klang mir ein bisschen zu positiv, wenn ich das sagen darf.“
“I just want to say this because that sounded to me a bit too positive, if I may say so.”


I sometimes almost despair at the idiocy demonstrated by the hypocritical delusional anti-americanism of many in Europe. A man from Mars would not credit it. Europe was saved from itself by the USA in two world wars plus the Cold War. If I was American I would want to let the Europeans stew in their own weak willed morally corrupt juice.



@germerican

The SPD, appears to me, to be the one whose is attempting to profit most from implying that America only has interests in Oil Rich countries. How would Müller have responded on America's decisive roll in ending the war in Bosnia? Without the obvious incentive of oil?

People who simply just buy into such SPD comments as this, are really a disappointment. They are a disappointment because they surrender their intellectual energy and buy into old rallying calls, slogans and platitudes. It is much easier to do so...

Tina,

The NYP’s the Axis of Weasels is the only direct negative article I have read in the last 3 years about any political leader in Europe.

I do think the NYP, the WT and the WSJ do at times write critical articles about some of the positions various European nations take. They do not attack the leaders or the citizens of those nations. I consider policy differences to be fair game on both sides of the Atlantic if facts are presented to support those differences. In most cases just pure hate and whining are the bases for most articles in the European press.

At the same time you have these critical news sources (NYP, WSJ, WT), whose articles always appear, in the editorial section of these papers, you have the cheerleaders too; NYT, BG, IHT, LAT, AJC, etc. The positions of these news sources are more closely align with the European press on most issues.

However, having said this I find most of the MSM and most Americans ignore much of what happens in Europe or indifferent to what happens.


Joe,

I agree with you that policy issues are always fair game. I think we do not though, get a fair picture from the MSM in the US or the foreign media. It's truly disheartening.

It's the personal (as in the SDZ article) garbage that I so object to.

The Axis of Weasels, while funny, was hardly helpful.

It strikes me that the article above is not just an attack on Bush, but a general attack on democracy as well. Anyone who has even a passing understanding of history must realize that there is little more precious than the right to periodically go to the ballot box and cast one's vote for the candidate of one's choice. A record number of Americans went to the polls last November and cast their vote. This was truly a victory for democracy everywhere. But the author of the article above, along with many others on the Left simply cannot accept the result, because it was not the result they wanted. This just goes to show how dangerous these people would be if they ever actually got some real power. It also explains why they ignore or denigrate the efforts of the US to bring democracy to Iraq and Afghanistan: They simply don't like democracy.

@Amihasser
Du kannst in die eine Hand wünschen und in die andere pinkeln (oder von mir aus wixxen). Mal sehen welche zuerst voll wird.

Du wirst wohl ein ziemlich bitteres Leben führen, denn die USA sind, und werden bis Deinem Lebensabend, eine Supermacht bleiben. Gewöhne Dich dran.

--What is their hope here anyway - that America see's the error of its ways and becomes like Europe?--

Yes, Pogue, for 228 years we were wrong and we need their guidance.

That's it in a nutshell.

The above article is quite unbelievable. I know why I do not read "Sueddeutsche".

By contrast, I have just seen the President´s inauguration speech on CNN. He was very much emphasizing on eternal values like freedom and liberty and that every human being has the right to be free. There is absolutely nothing to add.

Thank you, Mr. President!

Tina,

Not helpful in what way? (NYP picture)

Looking back it would appear that it was pretty spot on. Given that germany chose to align themselves with the french and they french were being paid off by Saddam. I see nothing noble at all in the postion france took. Maybe you do?

I have yet to be able to figure out all the contributing factors for the position germany took other than the spd won an election by being anti GWB and and in a way, more than most want to admit anti american. So far I have not found a principled position for their choice.

I actually find the sources that you think bash the euro's to present a much more accurate and balanced picture of them than the sources that are their cheerleaders. The german MSM seems to support my belief rather than to disprove it.

I might suggest you look for information in the UK press outside of the guardian as well as read some of the papers that are published by think tanks on both sides of the Atlantic.

If you disagree with that logic then I would like to hear why.

I disagree with you on your statement that we have more in common with the europeans than we have as disagreements btw. I am prepared but not today to explain why I believe that to be true.

It doesn't surprise me that there's such poisonous bias in German media. What surprises me is that it's in the mainstream, not the fringe.

Here's a chicken and egg question: is the fault with (a)the German media, (b) the German populace or, (c) both? Are the media and populace locked in a perverse symbiosis?

Joe,

Unhelpful in the sense that Axis of Weasels might be emotionally satisfying, but it doesn't further anything constructive.

I am not saying we should not call things out when they (or we) are being right bastards, but there is a far cry difference in being critical of one's actions and just calling someone a name. Axis of Weasels was just name calling.

We have a ton more in common than not. We come from a basic commonality of backgrounds and political heritage. We differ on how we execute these things, but the basis is quite similar. We do hold very similar values, even though, the US has tended to retain our religious heritage that Europe has seemingly abandoned (and not to their betterment, in my view).

Also, if you view this on a world level, we certainly have more in common with Europe, Japan, India and such than China, Russia and most if not all of the Middle East.

I didn't say they bashed them really. I agreed with you that they were critical and not on a personal level.

I also agree with you that I cannot find a principled stance on Germany's choices over the last 4 years either. I personally think that Europe just wants to sit the War on Terror out. Hardly a principled stance.

Wieder so ein grandioser Artikel in der Süddeutschen:

Das Desaster Irak

Wer wundert sich noch über die Bilder von Misshandlungen in Basra? Wer hört noch hin bei den Nachrichten über eine Bombe in Bagdad? Im Irak werden Perversionen und Gewalt in solchem Übermaß produziert, dass der Überdruss inzwischen sogar die Verantwortlichen ergriffen hat. Doch was nun? Ein Kommentar von Peter Münch


Ein paar knackige Zitate:


"Die Bilder aus dem Gefängnis von Abu Ghraib stehen seit Monaten für das Versagen der Amerikaner. Die Bilder aus dem so genannten Camp Brotkorb in Basra beweisen nun, dass auch die Briten ihnen im Schlechten nicht nachstehen."


"Mit Lügen ging es hinein in den Irak, wo die selbst ernannten Befreier ihren eigenen Anspruch Lügen straften – und mit Lügengebilden wollen sich Amerikaner und Briten nun baldmöglichst wieder aus ihrer Verantwortung stehlen."

"Die Kriegslüge muss ihre Fortsetzung in der Demokratielüge finden, weil kein anderer Weg mehr offen erscheint, um sich aus der heillosen Verstrickung zu befreien."

"Nicht die Iraker brauchen diese Wahl zu diesem Zeitpunkt, sondern die Regierungen in Washington und London, die sich von einer neuen Regierung in Bagdad das Ticket für die Heimkehr ihrer Truppen ausstellen lassen wollen."

"Amerikaner und Briten haben im Irak jegliche Glaubwürdigkeit verloren und ihrer Durchhalte-Rhetorik zum Trotz eingesehen, dass sie dort nichts mehr gewinnen können. Im Rückzug sehen sie die einzige Option, um den Schaden für sich selbst zu begrenzen. Der Schaden, den sie den Irakern zugefügt haben, ist grenzenlos."


http://www.sueddeutsche.de/ausland/artikel/405/46359/


Die SZ erreicht nach Mediaanalyse (2004) täglich 1,15 Millionen Leser und gehört damit zu den meistgelesensten überregionalen Zeitung in Deutschland. Unabhängig davon, was Amerika auch immer für Opfer bringt, wird auch weiterhin so berichtet, wie es den deutschen Redaktionen in den Kram passt, will heißen: so dass die Auflagenstärke stimmt. Der Niveau befindet sich von nun an gleichauf mit der linksextremen taz. Ich will nicht wissen, wo wir 2008 stehen werden.

Süddeutsche Zeitung am 20.1.2014

Gerhard Schröder ist tot. Er starb als großer Führer Eurabiens am letzten Wochenende auf seiner
fünften Hadsch nach Mekka.

2006 wurde Schröder nach der großen Überschwemmungskatastrophe am Rhein und dem Gewinn der Fußballvizeweltmeisterschaft zum dritten Male wiedergewählt.
Sofort nach der Wahl erklärte die deutsche Regierung die Freizügigkeit für alle türkischen Zuwanderer, die auch sofort das Wahlrecht erhielten.
So konnte es sich Schröder leisten, 2008 das Parlament aufzulösen und statt mit den Grünen danach mit der Partei
der islamischen Wiedergeburt zu regieren.

Nachdem Deutschland einen ständigen Sitz im Weltsicherheitsrat mit Vetorecht bekam, stieg Schröder zum Schutzherrn der arabisch-islamischen Welt auf. Nach seiner Konversion zum Islam kam es allerdings zur Scheidung von seiner vierten Frau Doris.
In einer großen Zeremonie heiratete der Kanzler aber dann die Tochter Erdogans und gleichzeitig die iranische Sängerin Isfahania. Deutschland lieferte Wafen an die Türkei und den Iran, die in einer gemeinsamen Aktion dann das zionistische Gebilde beseitigten.
Im Zuge dieses Krieges trat dann auch die NPD der Regierungskoalition bei.
Die überlebenden Zionisten wurden in die USA abgeschoben.

Die deutsche Politik am Hindukusch bewurkte allerdings den „Eintägigen Krieg“, einen
atomaren Schlagabtausch zwischen Indien und dem von Deutsch-Eurabia unterstützen Pakistan, der Bombay und
Karachi zerstörte und zum Sturz der Regierungen beider Länder.

Die Folge sind die bis heute anhaltenden Bürgerkriegsserien im Mittleren
Osten und auf dem indischen Subkontinent, in deren Verlauf seit 2010
keine herkömmlichen Waffen mehr eingesetzt wurden.

Nach Informationen der Vereinten Nationen, deren Sitz jetzt Hannover war, wurden rund 12 Millionen
Menschen getötet, weitere Millionen vertrieben.

Nach der vierten Wiederwahl Schröders wurde klar, dass diese Kriege in Asien den Nutzen hatten, Schröders Image und die Macht der SPD/PdiW im
Europaparlament, um Schröders Heimatagenda durchzusetzen.

Der Schriftsteller Martin Walser schrieb: „Mitteleuropa war das eigentliche
Ziel der Eroberung“. Nach dem Ausschluss Großbritanniens und der Niederlande aus der EU
wurde die deutsche Gesellschaft reformiert.
Alle christlichen Gebäude wurden zu Moscheen umgewandelt. Tausende von deutschen Männern saßen wegen illegaler Gentests im Gefängnis.

Alle Fernseh- und Rundfunksender wurden von der Parteileitung in Berlin geleitet.

2012 wurde aber Schröder von Oskar Lafontaine gestürzt, der die Gruppe "Rote Mullahs" anführte.

Nach seiner Kanzlerschaft war das Leben Schröders von Missgeschicken
gekennzeichnet. Seien beiden neuen Frauen verließen ihn.

Einige waren sicher, dass er wieder zu trinken begonnen hatte, denn es
sah so aus, als ob er die meiste Zeit in Privatclubs in Hannover
verbrachte, wo er seit 2012 wieder wohnte, direkt gegenüber dem UN-Hauptquartier.

Die UN hatte allerdings nur noch fünf Mitglieder:
Frankreich und sein großafrikanisches Reich, Deutsch-Eurabia, Pakistan, Luxemburg und das Großtürkische Reich.

Notiz von David: Roland, Deine Satire ist ausgezeichnet!

Tina,

OK I will start a post on why I disagree with your position we share more with the Europeans than we disagree with them with.

It might not make this thread but I will have it ready for a future date.

To give you an idea of just what this might look like. I want you to consdier this. President Bush gave his inaguration speech today. Do you think any world leader, with the possible exception of Blair, would give such a speech with the meaning that he did.

I surely cannot but then again you might know more leaders than I do. I surely do not see it coming from paris, berlin, madrid,brussels, moscow or any other captial you might want to choose.

(Hopefully you got to watch it live, if not maybe you can see it on CSPAN without the voice over of MSM)

GWB's speech was all about the differences between the US and the American people and those of europe, esepcially the french and germans.

Tina, and just what do you consider to be constructive? BTW I did not particular care for it either. I felt at the time and even more so now that france is an actually enemy of the US and should be treated accordingly. This feeling is now shared by more than 30% of Americans.

Think of that Tina, not just not being allies but being our enemy. This opinion being developed without the aide of either MSM or the adminstration. I find that to be truly amazing. Just what do you think that percentage would be if we had the drum beat that goes on in either franch or german MSM. It might be closer to 95%. It is also amazing how the Ameircan people came to this conclusion on their own. I believe they have gotten it right again. I am sure you might disagree but that is what is so wonderful about our nation. We have diversity of thoughts and ideas. Not something one finds every day in either france or germany.

To drive this point home to the rest of the Americans, it is the only unfortante thing to come out of GWB's victory. Just think today Kerry could be in CIC and off to ask for help from france and germany. That was his promise. And do you think the french and germans would deploy the european legions. Well I do not. Another point we probably disagree on.

But I do support your position on Dean. He has my vote to be the chairman of the dnc. Actually being a good demo or being like a good demo he has two votes from me. You vote early and often if you are a demo. *g*

Leute, das da oben ist eine Glosse, also bitte nicht so ernst nehmen. Damit ihr euch etwas beruhigt, hier etwas vergleichbares über deutsche Politiker, von einer deutschen Zeitung (oh Wunder, das gibt's auch):

"Geld, Suff, Weiber
Heruntergekommene Berufe: Der Minister (Fachmann für paradiesische Zustände)
[...]
Bei Joseph Fischer zum Beispiel ist es ein zyklisches Ab- und wieder Anschwellen, was nicht nur im ministeriellen Ehebett zu ständigen Irritationen führt. Auch auf dem internationalen Diplomatenparkett weiß man oft gar nicht mehr, wer da wieder heranhechelt, um einen deutschen Hochsitz im Sicherheitsrat einzufordern: Fischer? Rainer Calmund? Dick oder Doof?

Es lässt tief blicken, dass Fischer der beliebteste Minister im Lande ist, weit vor dem klinisch hyperaktiven Clement oder den sprechenden Rollmöpsen Ulla und Renate Schmidt. Ganz zu schweigen von Otto Schily, dessen Physiognomie immer weiter ins unappetitlich Riesenschildkrötenhafte driftet.

In der Provinz hat die Hybris der Ministerkaste mittlerweile eine Politikwüste aus Wahn und Willkür hinterlassen. Wie das Tagebuch des niedersächsischen Wissenschafts- und Kulturministers Lutz Stratmann beweist. Hier ein Auszug: "Montag: Eröffnung Herbstmarkt Bakum, anschließend Umtrunk mit Dorfschlampen im Gasthaus Meistermann. Mann, war da was los. Nachmittags: schwere Kopfschmerzen, Kürzung der Theatersubvention um 2 Millionen €. Dienstag: Liquidierung der geisteswissenschaftlichen Fakultät Hannover. Abends Verleihung des Staatspreises an die Schriftstellerin Felicitas Hoppe. Schlechte Laune, weil kein Umtrunk. Mittwoch: Eröffnung des Filmfestes Braunschweig. Stinklangweilig! Nachmittags Pressekonferenz. Thema: Rasur der Filmförderung. Donnerstag: Festival Theaterformen abgeschafft, dann ab nach Berlin, Einladung von DaimlerChrysler. Abends reichlich angeschickert wieder nach Braunschweig. Verleihung Zukunftspreis. An wen, hab ich vergessen, das grandiose Gelage nicht. Freitag: Stützbier und ausgiebiges Nickerchen beim ,Deutschen Vorlesetag' in Oldenburg, später heftiger Absturz beim Symposion ,Havarie im Windpark'. Samstag: Mit Höllenkater Ausstellungseröffnung im Landesmuseum Osnabrück, 25 Jahre Denkmalschutz - 400.000 Jahre Geschichte', echter Bockmist, immerhin umsonst gefrühstückt, aber kein Bier da! Zuschüsse müssen unbedingt eingefroren werden." Ein Verfahren, das deutschen Ministern ebenfalls ganz gut tun würde."

in der taz
http://www.taz.de/pt/2005/01/19/a0262.nf/text

Was hier allgemein in diesem Forum auffällt, ist der Mangel an Humor und Selbstironie...

@ Chomskybot

Das Erschreckendste aus meiner Sicht ist, daß abgesehen von den völlig geschmacklosen und unlustigen Fantasien über die private Zukunft der Bushs der Rest nur in geringem Maße von dem abweicht, was einem täglich in vorgeblich "objektiven" Berichten vorgesetzt wird. Man kann Glosse und normale Berichte kaum mehr unterscheiden.

Nun bin ich ein Purist und denke, daß selbst Wertungen wie "Irak-Debakel" (oder auch "Maut-") in einem Bericht nichts zu suchen haben, sondern einzig in einen Kommentar und als Meinung gekennzeichnet gehören. (Alternativ, und m. E. wäre das noch besser, könnten sich aber auch alle Journalisten als das offenbaren, was sie naturgegeben sind: voreingenommen und parteiisch. Wenn ein- für allemal der in Deutschland noch sehr lebendige Mythos des "objektiven" Journalisten beerdigt würde, und das auch jedem bewußt wäre, wäre ich weitaus entspannter.) Aber ich wäre ja heute schon zufrieden, wenn Bush nicht in jedem zweiten Artikel als Idiot, Gefahr für den Weltfrieden, Irrer, fanatischer Eiferer etc. präsentiert würde, und man das zumindest auf die Kommentare verlagern würde...

Tina and Joe--

I am something of a Francophile (I spent Election Day in France!) and am married to the daughter of German immigrants. I have cousins in Italy. So I worry about the split between the US and Europe.

What really worries me is what happens if the crisis hits. You are right that Americans are beginning to look upon France (and generally much of Europe) as the enemy.

And it is seeping into popular culture. Yes, American ALWAYS had a love-hate relationship with France. But the History Channel was advertising a documentary on the French Revolution with the tag line -- "For one night it will not kill you to love the French."

On Law & Order:SVU (one of the most popular t.v. shows in the US), some vaguely European suspect, a doctor accused of molesting children patients, responds by stating that the police office "is a bourgoious American" who yada yada yada -- to which the officer responds "You lost me at bourgeois.

So what does this mean? I worry that when (not if, but when) the crisis hits Europe, we will sit out. And instead of nipping the crisis in the bud (like what might have happened had we allied with Britain and France in 1938) we will find ourselves in a worse position.

Germerican--

ONe thing about the US going to the "oil region" -- the Aceh province seems to have been the hardest hit. The earthquake was off its shores and the tsunami hit with the most force.

Sri Lanka, which also was hit hard, was aided almost immediately by the Indian Navy. Thailand was not that hard hit and other areas, the damage seemed confined to immediate coastal areas.

In short, if there is a huge disaster, you send help where it is most needed. And so the US and Aussies immediately headed for Aceh.

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