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Comments

I wonder where Stern's sense of justice was when Daimler Benz acquired Chrysler and proceeded to "rightsize?" Hmmm.

CDU's Norbert Blüm says today: "I would send the bosses to the desert." Blümchen has a strange understanding of economic topics.

When the world is becoming more complex, conspiracy-theories are extraordinary popular, especially in Germany. The antiamerican resentment is everywhere. It's eased the brain - the main-reason why Moore's books are a bestseller.

Whats up with the cowboy boots? The last time I looked there were zero cowpokes in Detroit. The CEO, Richard Wagoner, is from Deleware...lots of ranch land and steers. Dubya? What does he have to do with GM? Will Gerhard Schroeder reciprocate and have DaimlerChrysler AG lay off American autoworkers?

They already did! And Der "We hate America" Stern was none too concerned.

When can we expect the Stern cover on the KarstadtQuelle job cuts? Will it feature a jackbooted thug stomping on poor little people?

If this continues, Americans in Germany will be forced to wear white stars on their coats by this time next year.

Ray - none of this should come as a surprise to you or anyone else who is not German. Germany is now a nation of victims. They have no responsiblity for their own actions nor should they be expected to share any world wide responsiblities. They have become a nation of the fearful, the self centered and the selfish. They also seem to be filled with resentment.

One only has to read the comments of jo to clearly see this.

The sad part of this is they are in a nation which is declining. As they refuse to accept the reality of this, then there is no real hope for the future to become brighter for them.

So lead my their MSN they lash out and pass reponsiblity to others.

I look at this and think "Oh, well". Maybe GM should just move everything east. It could be no worse.

I am no friend of Nazi comparisons. But this "STERN" cover is truly disgusting stuff, indeed.

Other covers of the past with the same antiamerican attitude:

Morally bankrupt:

http://www.stern.de/_content/52/41/524185/heft_22_2004_162.jpg

How America lies to the world:

http://www.stern.de/_content/52/12/521299/heft_12_2004_162.jpg

The new Vietnam:

http://www.stern.de/_content/51/58/515886/Heft_48_2003_162.jpg

From loudmouth to petitioner:

http://www.stern.de/magazin/heft/index.html?id=512667&nv=ma_ah

The breakdown of the CIA:

http://www.stern.de/magazin/heft/index.html?id=511572&nv=ma_ah

The disenchant superpower:

http://www.stern.de/_content/50/61/506112/titel_magazin.jpg

American on warpath:

http://www.stern.de/_content/50/44/504432/stern_10.jpg

Insurgence against America:

http://www.stern.de/_content/50/41/504158/titel_heft09.jpg

Why Bush will war:

http://www.stern.de/_content/50/32/503221/titel.jpg

Any other questions about the stern? I hope not.

re: cowboy boots and Detroit, the reality is that most Europeans are dreadfully ignorant about the US -- and too intellectually lazy and smug to remedy that situation.

I've nearly given up on western Europe -- and I have family there.

Bei Vergleichen der Gegenwärtigen Sprache mit der Sprache der Nazis hat man natürlich den Gesamtzusammenhang im der damaligen Zeit Auge, und die Grimassen, die damaligen Redner fürs Publikum aufsetzten.
Wenn man nur die Texte für sich nimmt, klingen sie schon etwas entschärfter. Hier kann sich die Sprache von damals schon mit der heutigen vergleichen.
ZB.

Hitlers Rede vor dem Reichstag am 1.Sept.1939
(hier wird neun mal das Wort "peace" verwendet)
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/wwii/gp2.htm

Kriegserklärung Deutschlands an die USA 11.Dezember 1941
(bemerkenswert der Verweis auf "international law")
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/wwii/gerdec41.htm

As a German, I feel ashamed of "Stern". This might be a fair example that anti-semetism and anti-americanism goes hand in hand (and anti-zionis and anti-bushism as well).

But please keep in mind that not all Germans are that way, which is proven by Heinrich Maetzke in just the article above.

Please do not leave me alone in this zeropa. No pasaran, as one can read in another fine blog :-)))

Shalom shabbat and have a nice weekend

And this is why David's Medienkritik -- in spite of his blatant pro-Bush slant -- remains an essential part of my life in Germany. To any German reader who doubts the existence of blatant anti-americanism in Germany, this Stern cover is just another example. Germany, open your eyes!

Joe, you are right on: this is the era of the victim in Germany. There was a superb article by Norbert Frei (a professor of history in Bochum) in Die Zeit yesterday about how self-serving the changes in emphasis on German history are, now focusing on how the Germans were victims of the nazis and the "brutal" allied response. (Die erinnerungsschlacht um den 60. Jahrestag des Krigsendes 1945 hat begonnen. Deutschland steht vor einer Wende im Umgang mit seiner Vergangenheit.) I'll take Goldhagen's thesis any day over that "Mist" if forced to choose.

Make no mistake, there are a lot of decent Germans such as Florian who are ashamed by this kind of German pettiness. Unfortunately, many less thoughtful Germans ARE influenced by this constant barrage of hate. It leads to a general prejudice against America and a deep suspicion of all things American, including individual Americans.

I applaud the Germans for scrutinizing the failings of management in German companies. In America we let our managers off too lightly in the press when they screw up, and often we don't want to see the connection between their screw-ups and lost jobs. But to swing the club of anti-americanism at this stage is absurd (See Quelle/Karstadt). In the Stern's world view, it is not a bunch of incompetent American managers that is stepping on the poor oppressed Opel workers, it is the United States of America as a whole. Chilling pettiness. What losers.

"But please keep in mind that not all Germans are that way, which is proven by Heinrich Maetzke in just the article above."

Indeed. My wife's another, she even thinks both Saddam Hussein and al-qaeda are actually worse than Bush. :/

On a lighter note that magazine cover looks like the cover art was done for a 1970's Popular Mechanics. It is pretty low grade.

More seriously. I can see why Europe and the tribalists fear and hate the United States of America. We are an amalgamation. We are not one race, one tribe or one faith. We are totally unlike any nation before except perhaps the Roman Empire. We are very unlike the Germans. When and if the United States of America becomes a true multicultural nation instead of a "melting pot" the nation will begin a long decline. People become "Americans" as much as I hate that inaccurate label by adopting the way of life of the United States of America. They give up their old ways and loyalties and The USofA becomes them when they do. That a political and economic system could be so attractive to outsiders as to entice people to make that kind of leap of faith and risk of fortune must scare the hell out of those in the world that believe that the state should control the people and the economy rather than the reverse. Add to that the poor performance of the economy of the EU which under reports how bad it really is and you can fill many magazines and newspapers with distractions about how the US is to fault for all of these problems. The hate is based on envy.

As for Germany I just checked the Netscape Network list of top news stories from EUrope. Germany didn't even feature in the 25 stories listed by title. The words Germany or German don't even occur in the topics of any of the articles. Germany has nothing to contribute. Germany has no military power to conrtibue to the war on terror beside a token force. Germany can't even admit it is a war. Perhaps Stern is missing the real story here and it is a local one. When the economy colapses in Germany or the terrorists attack Germany I am sure it will be my fault here in the United States. Modern Germany is just a small bit older than I am. I think it's time for it to grow up.

Ich denke, wir können die deutsche Haltung nicht isoliert sehen. Es ist eine bestimmte typische Haltung, wie sie auch die Hälfte der Amerikaner hat. Darum geht es. Es ist ein weltweites Problem. Diese deutsche Kerry-Haltung beansprucht für sich Positivwörter wie Frieden, Diplomatie, Multilateralismus, Toleranz etc. Dem Gegner schreibt man Militarismus, Krieg, Bomben, Töten, Folter etc. zu. Der Gegner ist auch noch jüdisch, religiös und konservativ, was man in Deutschland gerne als RECHTS brandmarkt. Rechts neben Hitler. Diesen Krieg der Worte führt man noch härter in den USA.

Da helfen nur Fakten, Fakten, Fakten.

Ich kann es immer noch nicht glauben, daß so viele hier in Europa und drüben in den USA nicht erkennen, daß 9/11 bereits ein Riesenschlag war. Warum hat das nicht ausgereicht? Der nächste könnte mit biologischen oder chemischen Waffen sein. Hahha, Saddam Hussein hatte gar keine?! Wie einfältig muß man sein, um dann zu dem Schluß zu kommen, daß die Gefahr der Proliferation, der Weitergabe an Terroristen gar keine reale Gefahr sei. 9/11 hätte Bush verhindern können, schallt es gerade aus dem demokratischen Lager in der USA, aber alles was Bush tut, um ein zweites 9/11 zu verhindern, wird aufs Schärfste attackiert. Der Irakkrieg hat Saddam Hussein gestoppt. Dieser Mann und seine Söhne und Anhänger können nicht mehr nach Aufhebung der UN-Sanktionen Waffen bauen und weitergeben. Sie können nicht mehr den palästinenischen Terror unterstützen. Woher nehmen Kerry und seine europäischen Unterstützer nur den Glauben, daß Saddam und Al-Kaida mit Teetrinken hätten beruhigt werden können?

Kerry und seine Fans helfen dabei, die amerikanische Glaubwürdigkeit anzuzweifeln. Er hofft oder glaubt sogar, daß der Haß nur gegen Bush geht. Er verkennt die Natur des Hasses.

Noch ist es kein Thema, daß Kerry jüdische Vorfahren hatte. Aber wehe, wenn er nicht zum Wohlgefallen der Europäer handelt. Dann wird man das auskramen und ihn niedermachen, wie man es mit Wolfowitz macht und allen anderen, die seinen Glauben teilen.

Dann nutzt ihm seine Namensänderung gar nichts und daß er einem anderen Glaubensverein beigetreten ist.

Dann kann man sehen, wie Antisemtismus und Antiamerikanismus zusammenfallen.

Brauchen wir erst einen Kerry, um das zu entdecken?

Es ist alles schon passiert. Damals wurden die Zeichen nicht erkannt. Heute durchblättert man den Stern und Spiegel, liest die SZ und freut sich an Hetze gegen USA und Israel. Man nennt sie allerdings Kritik, ein positives Wort.

Wahlkampf in den USA - die Demokraten mögen sich prüfen, wieviel sie bereit sind für die Machtübernahme zu geben: Mehr Haß für Bush, damit Kerry gewinnt und dann?

Wie gedenkt man das loderne Feuer in Europa zu löschen? Man hat bereits angefangen, den palästinensischen Terror als "Widerstand gegen Besatzung" zu verniedlichen. Das war bisher nur mainstream in arabischen Ländern. Nun schallt es gemeinsam in Europa und den arabischen Länder: Nieder mit dem Zionismus und gegen die israelische Besatzung. Erste deutsche Terrorhelfer werden noch als Einzelkämpfer verharmlost. Aber die Propaganda in den Medien läßt doch keine andere Haltung mehr zu: Terror gegen Besatzung muß sein, aber Kampf gegen Terror ist zu bekämpfen. Wenn das dann noch "Pazifisten" verbreiten, ist es der Gipfel von Dummheit und Heuchelei.

Was ich absolut bemerkenswert finde, ist, daß man gleichzeitig gegen alles Jüdische hetzt (man nennt dies allerdings nur Sharon-Kritik) und gegen rechts, wobei man rechts mit Nazideutschland gleichsetzt.


Gabi, yawn, you're much more persuasive when you stick to Germany. You're so far out in right field in your attempts to link Kerry to the anti-american, pacifist socialist left in Europe that it undermines everything else you say. You come across as an ideologue -- a pleasant one, but an ideologue all the same. Besides, you're way off topic on this thread.

Karl, is Kerry critical or hateful? Are democrats critical or hateful? Remember this article: I hate Bush, the way he smiles and walks and so on. I don't talk about YOU, Karl. I talk about the mainstream in the Democratic Party.

Israel has the same problem with Uri Avnery and some others. Are they antisemtic? Not possible because they are Jewish?

I know you prefer Kerry but this should not stop you to think about Antiamerikanism shared by Americans.

I am sorry, I don't like the hate which Kerry is spreading (versprühen). I don't like his remarks about Cheney's daughter. There are plenty of people in this world who still hate lesbians and homosexuells. It is hypocrisy to ignore this and mention his lesbian daughter. This is not honest.


yeah gabi,

- as if the anti-american, pacifist socialist european left would support kerry and demonize bush

- or as if the anti-american, pacifist socialist american left would side with americas enemies to defeat bush (and out of habit), you must be crazy to even think of it, I could never imagine the kerry campaign embracing rabid anti-american leftists like michael moore, shame on you for your innuendo

better shut up and listen to uncle karl

Yes, some opinions hurt, Christian, learn to debate, learn to listen to others, learn to accept opinions you don't like. Karl does not need supporters like you. We know each other long enough to talk about different opinions without using terms like "shut up".

hm, I'm sry, but I though the irony (kerry, even if one 'forgets' all his vietnam era activities, has a visible connection to the far left, european and american, karl shouldn't try to 'shut up' you, gabi) was obvious, and though I really might be unable to participate in a reasonable discussion HERE, I never used terms like 'shut up' regarding other people than me or in a sarcastic sense,

ie: I DID NOT MEAN IT LIKE YOU UNDERSTOOD IT!!!

sry for your bad feelings I though I would had made me clear, sry!

'thought'

I'm out of here again, German media make me feel sick, you, david and ray must have a stomach of steel

ps:

to avoid more misunderstanding

german media = spiegel, stern, focus (fakten, fakten, fakten) = bad
medienkritik and gabi = good

ok and I learn better English! :-)

This cover shocked me too. One reason I haven't been commenting much as of late is that I no longer pay much attention to the German media, preferring to get my news and analysis through blogs. But magazine covers like this cannot be ignored. There's nothing I can say about it that hasn't been said, except to reiterate the stupidity of lambasting a company based in Detroit as 'Wild West' (I guess Detroit used to be considered part of the West - about two hundred years ago) and the disgusting and facile way Stern applies the cowboy stereotype to all things American.

Here's a choice bit of anti-American ignorance for your reading pleasure.

"Es geht nicht um eine Person, sondern um eine Ideologie. Die teilt Bush mit Millionen von Wählern, die nicht verschwunden sein werden, sobald Kerry an der Regierung ist. Sie werden bleiben und weiterhin Hetzjagd auf Schwarze, Schwule, selbstbewusste Frauen und Migranten betreiben."


Yes, Bush is against black people and self-confident women. That's why he appointed Condaleeza Rice as his National Security Adviser.

From an article in a German rock magazine.
http://www.intro.de/index.php?nav=50&con=/magazin/magazin&einzelartikel=1096375967&

Cowboy Capitalists:
5.4% Unemployment

Socialist Stooges:
10.3% Unemployment


Does GM own Porsche?

Porsche, the German maker of luxury sports cars, wants to extend working hours and cut jobs, its chairman said in a newspaper interview Wednesday at a time when other car makers in Germany are also drastically reducing their workforce in an attempt to drive down costs. "In our production facilities, those jobs that become free are not being replaced since we have been able to sharply increase output per worker," Porsche chairman Wendelin Wiedeking told the Financial Times Deutschland without providing any concrete figures. In August 2003, when Porsche held its last headcount, the car maker employed a workforce of just over 10,000. Porsche has embarked on a programme to boost productivity to help counter the negative effects of the weak dollar, Wiedeking said. "We're holding intensive talks with workers, for example about the infamous five-minute 'pee break'" that forms part of a wage

agreement in Porsche's home state of Baden-Württemberg, Wiedeking said. The break, which gives workers five minutes every hour to go the toilet, "is a relic that needs to be looked at," the chairman said. Fellow car maker DaimlerChrysler recently succeeded in abolishing the break and extending working hours at the end of a recent fierce battle with employees. (AFP)

Where can I get a pair of boots like that?

Laugh now, but Germany's economy is turning around and will be hailed as a "success story" over the next few years while the U.S. continues its slow decline.

As for the unemployment figures, there's no basis for comparison. The U.S. fudges its numbers. If discouraged and workforce dropouts were counted, our rate currently would be over 9%, not much different from that of 'socialist' Germany. And at least there you can actually get healthcare if you are ill.

How is it that we Americans can (reportedly) treasure our Freedom of the Press so highly, but then read a magazine from another country that is critical of our government and its actions and we start to bad-mouth the publication and then proceed to pin the 'sins' of the publication on every member of that society?

It's a magazine with its own agenda. It's no different than when U.S. citizens started slamming our pre-Revolution ally France because they wouldn't just kowtow to w's (now proven-false) claims about Iraq and Saddam. We seem to forget that friends and allies do not have to agree on every single issue--we'd then be the same country. When my friends are gonna do something stupid, I tell them. I feel that I have to. I expect the same of them. When I'm right, I know that I tried to help. When I'm wrong, at least I spoke up and they know that I had their best interest at heart.

How country was founded on dissent. We are rebels by the very nature of our founding fathers' intent. They came here and fought and died so that we can say what we want, when we want about whom we want without fear of persecution. Without that right, even this site would be blocked. (see China.)

How did we become so arrogant that some of us honestly believe 1) everything the members of our government tell us, and 2) that our country has never done a single thing wrong throughout its history?

The facts of the matter are that we, as a society, are too lazy to determine our opinions on our own (too many of us accept whatever dogma washington dumps on us) and that we're so unsure of our positions and beliefs that we feel that they can't stand up to criticism of any kind.

If a belief isn't tested, it's only an opinion. Every one of us needs to take in the point of the article, see if it COULD have merit, then either fix the problem or discount them as the German equivalent of Fox News. Judging the article based on the cover is just silly and lazy.

Without dissent, our government will stagnate and we'll be back in the same position we were when fleeing England. Only through dissent will our beliefs be tested and therefore proven. And improved.

I remember Robert Heinlein saying that there was somethign ultimately rotten in the heart of Germany. It's too bad, I love the German craftsmanship of various products, but...

Will we hear again in our lifetime, "We need breathing room?"

Actually, I'm more worried about my country, the US, than Germany. Americans are (too many) fat, lazy and stupidly uninformed. It's hard to make a representative republic work when the population has let their brains turn to sludge.

Robert there’s a difference between reasoned criticism and engaging dishonest, destructive propaganda.

I suggest you learn the difference. If you'd like to know what effect unchecked, ignorant propaganda can have on a government and a people. Just ask any one of the German citizens posting here to explain 1930's-40's Germany to you.

Obviously you never learned that lesson. I imagine some apologist just like you said something quite similar about the cover of a 1930's era German magazine that pinned the woes of the fatherland on the Jew.

Pull your head out Robert.

Mike

@ Robert:

"How did we become so arrogant that some of us honestly believe 1) everything the members of our government tell us, and 2) that our country has never done a single thing wrong throughout its history?"

Talk about knocking down strawmen. Who (either German or American) has done that here Robert? So now we are all mind-numbed robots blindly following the government...?

"We seem to forget that friends and allies do not have to agree on every single issue--we'd then be the same country."

Another straw man Robert. No one here expects Germany and the US to agree on everything and no one here ever has. This is about what "Stern" is doing: Spreading hate through stereotypes. It's wrong and it's no way to treat a friend.

"Judging the article based on the cover is just silly and lazy."

So you wouldn't be offended if TIME or NEWSWEEK had a cover that stereotyped Germans as a bunch of evil lederhosen-wearing incompetents destroying American jobs? What if they show a German stormtrooper boot stepping on American workers the next time Daimler-Chrysler, BMW or Volkswagen lay people off in the US?

Or what if we had a magazine cover depicting all Jews as evil or all blacks as criminal Robert? Riiight...we'd have to read the article to figure out if it is really bad or not...

First of all, I don't think that such a cover picture would be acceptable in the USA. Secondly, I don't think American journalists (despite the fact that they are biased) would do something so incredibly unprofessional and politically incorrect.

Without dissent, our government will stagnate and we'll be back in the same position we were when fleeing England. Only through dissent will our beliefs be tested and therefore proven. And improved.

For once, I agree entirely. That's why we're never gonna stop challenging the Big Media in Germany and its poisonous influence on German-American relations. In Germany they are the mainstream, they are the authority...that is something we have to change.

I wasn't judging the article based on the cover, Robert, I was judging the cover based on the cover. And I have no desire to open a magazine that would print such a cover.

Robert and Dana, cheers to you. It slays me that the second anyone points out American failures and wrong-doings, they're all of a sudden cast as apologists for German neo-socialist nazis and Islamic terrorist nut-jobs. It is possible to decry both sides.

Dana, you're 100% right about a large population blindly following the current government in the States. A true, frightening example of this is the sheer number of Americans who buy the schtick that to criticize Bush is to be un-American. Sounds like pretty scary stuff.

@ Waiting:

"A true, frightening example of this is the sheer number of Americans who buy the schtick that to criticize Bush is to be un-American."

Who ever said it was "un-American" to criticize Bush? That is simply another bogus myth. Right now half of America seems to have no problem with criticizing Bush. In fact, Bush has been criticized by more people more often in the past few months than any President I can remember in recent history.

"It slays me that the second anyone points out American failures and wrong-doings, they're all of a sudden cast as apologists for German neo-socialist nazis and Islamic terrorist nut-jobs. It is possible to decry both sides."

So do you feel that Stern's cover is an appropriate way to "point out American failures"? Is Stern's cover conducive to improving German-American relations and fostering dialogue? Get real!

We are not trying to "cast" anyone as anything. We are simply pointing out the incredibly ugly methods used by Stern to sell magazines by invoking the most base and vulgar of stereotypes and appealing to peoples' dark anti-American emotions and sentiments. In fact, Andrew Sullivan, who you could hardly accuse of being right-wing, agrees that this cover is outrageous and linked this story earlier today.

It seems that if you have nothing to bring against our arguments that you and folks like Robert resort to setting up and knocking down strawmen of your own making. How do you expect us to take you seriously when you sit there and condone this sort of intolerable behavior on the part of Stern? The answer is: We can't.

The only ones claiming people are un-American are Democrats like Teresa Heinz Kerry. And the Democrats are the ones who claim that anyone who criticizes them is attacking their patriotism

Barbara Hamm = Enkelkind von Goebbels

Robert, I think you need to stick around a while and read some of the other threads here. Talk to Americans who have lived here for many years. There are articles on the history of anti-americanism in Europe that you can find on the web. (Try MEMRI). Some of what is going on has to do with Bush's handling of Iraq and his diplomacy in general, but some of it is nothing more than a pretext for beating the drums of hatred against America. It was there before Bush and it will continue long after Bush is gone. It waxes and wanes depending on the political climate. Schröder instrumentalizes it to stay in power, as do socialists elsewhere (e.g., Spain). He also instrumentalizes it as part of his German foreign policy to increase Germany's presence on the world stage. He is welcomed with open arms by every country that has a grudge against America. He is marketing Germany in a way similar to the way France does: as a counterweight to America. He denies it when confronted, but he really only pays lip service to the idea of close reltaions with America. Unfortunately, it is a popular attitude. Only a minority of Germans have any special feelings towards America today (recent polls confirm this). If it weren't for a small group of dedicated and influential Germans (Die Transatlantiker), our reltaions would be much worse. Fortunately, the economic ties are very close and not likely to decrease in our lifetimes. This insures a steady stream of future Transatlantiker.

What worry's me lately is that it now appears to have become OK to take sneering jabs at America on prime time TV. I've lost track at the number of snide comments about "die Amis" (the Americans) that I've heard by entertainers lately. Even so-called "friends" of America such as Thomas Gottschalk spread a smarmy, condescending portrait of my country. Last night it was Happe (sp?) Kerkeling on a German quiz show, who, snidely addressing an imagined "Ami" audience (he used the term), lectured that "no, dear Amis, the capital of Germany is not Heidelberg" (Heidelberg pronounced with a thick American accent). Refrain: Amis are ignorant and, therefore, laughable (insert clicheed cowboy image here). This fits in with a German tradition of tasteless clichee. You'll see blacks and turks portrayed here in ways that would ruin careers back in the States. And it is acceptable to rag about minorities in public. As one of my Jewish friends remarked to me after a visit to the hair salon, the way the old ladies were ragging about the Turks gave him a good idea of what it must have been like to be a Jew in Germany in the early thirties. Mostly, it's just talk, but every once in a while it boils over into hate crime, especially in the East.

End of report from the front.

That's why I appreciate Karl's comments here very much.

But, Karl, don't you see the connection to Antiamericanism, when Kerry is using this hatred and blames Bush for it? Think the unthinkable. I know you like Kerry and won't hurt you. I am German and accept any president the American people will choose. But Kerry has an interest in increasing this hatred. This is a dangerous game what all Americans will loose. Hatred does not ask if you are Democratic or Republican.

Gabi, I had decided to let your earlier post slide. I actually deleted a response to you to keep this thread on topic. But you just don't seem to know when to stop.

This is an election year. There is hatred coming from both sides. Your singular focus on the hatred on the left towards Bush is partisan, and you appear to be blind to the hatred coming from the right towards Kerry. To turn your argument around, attacks on Kerry from the right are also attacks on America, so the right in America is guilty of anti-americanism. That sounds ridiculous, right? So does your argument. You are equating Bush with America. Isn't that what many Europeans do to foster more anti-americansim? It doesn't work with them and it won't work for you.

Throwing your arguments back at you, I can argue that some of the Republican behavior is just as "anti-american" as what you lament. Anyone trying to undermine the separation of church and state in America might as well emigrate to Iran; they arguably are unamerican in the purest sense of the word. These fundamentalist types are on the right, they are very influential under Bush, and they spew hatred against lots of different people.

You want to see hatred, listen to the hatred that Rush Limbaugh spews every day or read the diatribes at David Horowitz's site (he's an old black panther supporter from the Sixties who suddenly "saw the light" and now is as radical a rightist as he used to be a leftist). Furthermore, I find the right's attacks on Kerry's war record despicable and "unpatriotic". Most of the guys around Bush, such as Cheney, who are attacking Kerry's patriotism got deferments in Vietnam or, as Bush, have dubious service records. I find suggestions by Bush & Cheney, the men in charge who had a chance to prevent 9-11 and didn't, that somehow we will be less safe under Kerry hateful and despicable. I find the personal smear campaigns launched by the White House against anyone who dared to speak up against Bush on Iraq to be hateful and despicable. As Tom Friedman points out, the Republicans are guilty of their own lack of patriotism for putting the well-being of Bush and their party above taking corrective action in Iraq. Gee, this is fun.

You want to know where most of the hatred in America comes from Gabi? Do you remember or have you read about how hated Kennedy was by the right in America? Remember the assassination and the stories of cheering classrooms in Dallas? Remember the assassination of Martin Luther King? That hatred came from the right Gabi, not the left. And, as someone who spent most of his "former" life in the South and can remember separate bathrooms and water fountains for blacks, I can assure you that the right in America has used the race issue (i.e. spreading fear and hatred of minorities) in subtle ways to its advantage to garner support in the South. Without the South, Bush would not have a chance of winning the election. In this way, the electoral college plays to his advantage. Don't get me wrong, Bush is not a racist, but the race card IS played by the right to win elections.

Get my point? We can argue back and forth about it, but this is not the right place. I'm just real tired of your harking on this same theme when the focus is supposed to be on German Media. This is my last post on this thread.

Glad to see that Andrew Sullivan linked to Ray's post. Shame on Der Stern!

Karl, this url is for you. I talk and write about the president of the USA. At the moment it is Bush. So think about it if you feel better. And think about why you reacted so exaggerated when I am posting SOME remarks about Antiamericanism and Kerry. The truth hurts, Karl. I got your point but I thought you are open for different opinions. You are not, you share this with many people here in Germany.


The Telegraph in UK has a great article:

If Bush loses, the winner won't be Kerry: it will be Zarqawi
By Charles Moore
(Filed: 23/10/2004)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2004/10/23/do2301.xml&sSheet=/opinion/2004/10/23/ixopinion.html

I am not pro-Bush, I am pro of the president of the US. When Kerry will win, I will support him in the fight of terror. I have no idea of American politics. I thought it was terrible when the Rebublican threw shit on Clinton and Clinton was so weak. Of course it was Clinton himself who did the "shit" with Monica Lewinsky. But this investigation and talk about it for about 2 years or more, that was wrong and it weakened the US in the world.

Now this talk about lies and lies and lies is much more worse than the talk about Monica L. And again it weakened the US, I have no doubts about this. Read the commentaries in the Arabic world.

Does democracy mean you support only your own party, Karl? I am here to support Bush in his fight against terror because I think he and Blair and some others are on the right way. If Kerry will win and will go on with this politics, I will support him as I do now with Bush. I support the president of the US because the world needs a strong US in this fight against terrorism.

And the Democrats need to realize that their lies-talk is helping the terrorists like Europe is helping the terrorists when they try to weaken the US.


Karl, both sides are cynical in their manipulation of the electorate. Perhaps they know it works, and are not concerned with the effect on the nation.

This morning, the Boston Globe published yet another political cartoon repeating the myth that the US Supreme Court handed the election to Bush in 2000. I have read both decisions by the Florida Supreme Court and the remand and final decision by the USSC. The Florida opinions were fluffy nonsense appealing to principals not embodied in the law set before them. They were asked on remand to address specific issues of the law, and instead repeated the nonsense. Yet the lie persists, four years later, kept alive for partisan purposes. The "He's not my President" bumper stickers cut the root of democracy -- the peaceful and orderly succession of power after an election.

I leave it to you to furnish examples from the right. Please refer to facts in the public domain, not things that "everybody knows..." This is properly known as an informal fallacy ("Appeal to Public Opinion") and the "everybody" is usually the speaker's friends and allies.

I think it's helpful to remember that "propaganda" is a morally neutral word. The negative connotation comes from "false propaganda". If you read that Goebbels quote and insert "effective advertisement" in place of "propaganda", you see that what he's saying is essentially true and not quite as evil sounding.

And yes, I know he actually was evil, but that's neither here nor there.

Mitch, I read the judgement: They only stopped the manual count. The court did not elect the president. That is nonsense.

So when BMW closes the doors of an US factory then Time/Newsweek will make a cover with Nazi boots ...

Alas, I can't read your highly recommended site; a vertical grey stripe of praise blocks the narrative.

hi, I find it rather ironic that within a post dedicated to the outrageousness of a perceived anti-american "propaganda" magazine cover in Germany, you also find room to criticize Democrats in America who have the nerve to stand up to actual propaganda.

You might not know it but in the US the public owns the airwaves that companies like sinclair broadcast over. We trust the government to manage who gets on those airwaves and to make sure they aren't abused or monopolized by anyone.

Sinclair owns local network affiliates--stations anyone with an antennae can pick up, and one of the last bastions of local media control. They are the only company that frequently forces ALL of their dozens of local affiliates to air certain things, such as centrally produced nightly "news" programs and the right wing commentary of the president of the company. And now they are abusing their trust by forcing dozens of their stations to air an hourlong anti kerry commercial on the public airwaves, using the priveleges granted them by the government to beam unsolicited propaganda into the homes of millions of americans in an attempt to influence an election.

So please, spare me you righteous indignation. Michaele Moore can't even show his film on pay per view. Propaganda is propaganda, but in America, freedom of speech gives people like michaele moore the right to make their propaganda and invite people to come out and shell out ten bucks to see it. Anyone but a blind partisan will realize the difference between showing a movie in a theater or selling it on a dvd, and force feeding your propaganda over the public airwaves unsolicited into peoples homes. If you're OK with that, you're a hypocrite.

lucklucky writes:

"So when BMW closes the doors of an US factory then Time/Newsweek will make a cover with Nazi boots"

By the American edition, yes. But there are different editions of Time and Newsweek. Whereas the US-Edition has Nazi boots on the cover, the Europe-Edition shows in big letters: "Europe is back. The new superpower dominates the world economy, America is going down ... blah, blah, blah"

@ luud

Force feeding? You make it sound like that scene in Clockwork Orange. Ever heard of the power button? Ever changed a channel luud? This isn't Communist East Germany where you just have one or two state channels although I know some Socialists and Communists long for those days. Your entire premise just imploded my friend.

Yes, luud, it is a double-standard for Democrats to protest Stolen Honor while they invite Michael Moore to their conventions and seat him next to President Carter in the VIP booth. Please spare us your heroic portrayals of Democrats "standing up to propaganda." They'll stand up to propaganda about as long as it harms their man and wine and dine with those producing anti-Bush propaganda. The truth hurts but it is the truth nonetheless.

I also don't buy your argument that this is totally different because this is tv and not the movies, if that is all you have to base your argument on then that is pretty weak. Partisan propaganda is partisan propaganda on tv and at the movies.

We trust the government to manage who gets on those airwaves and to make sure they aren't abused or monopolized by anyone.

Ever read the book "BIAS" by Bernard Goldberg? Trying to claim that US television is being monopolized by conservatives is about like trying to call North Korea a democracy. About 70-80% of the US media is comprised of Democrats.

Now one company wants to show one film that makes Kerry look bad (and they invited the Democrats to give their side of the story by the way) and suddenly they are being sued, boycotted and intimidated by the left.

So get real luud, people know real hypocrisy and falsehoods when they see them. And the attempts to take "Stolen Honor" off the airwaves are real hypocrisy and censorship, not some noble campaign to defeat propaganda.

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